Walter Smith

[maineflyer 0]

Personally, I'd sack Smith now. I've felt like that since the day he was appointed.

[Zappa 0]

Welcome :cheers:

 

Thanks mate. :cheers:

 

I personally think the way that some 'fans' are shooting their mouths off about Walter, crying out for his head on a stake etc, is just incredible. You'd think he & his staff hadn't just taken us to our first European final in decades. In fact you'd think we'd just been relegated, the way some folks are rattling on. :roll:

[Gribz 743]

I think all fans know its only pre season and nothing gets decided here. But the frustration is coming from the fact Ferguson got injured yet no midfielders have been brought in despite the need for 1 or 2 before Ferguson got injured.

 

Add the addition of the strikers and then the concentration of buying a defender the fans are scratching our heads about how we are going to line up next season.

[ascender 352]

Of course its too early to call for his head, but apart from the failure to sign a creative midfielder, many fans seem to be getting frustrated by the fact he's repeating many of the mistakes & bad habits he made during his first tenure. I don't think its one actual thing he's done over the rest of them (see the other threads on here for a list), but I get the feeling that it could turn nasty for him quite quickly from a large section of the support if we don't get off to a good start.

 

But for some, both he and SDM are above any reproach because they delivered 9 in a row.

[calscot 0]

Of course its too early to call for his head, but apart from the failure to sign a creative midfielder, many fans seem to be getting frustrated by the fact he's repeating many of the mistakes & bad habits he made during his first tenure. I don't think its one actual thing he's done over the rest of them (see the other threads on here for a list), but I get the feeling that it could turn nasty for him quite quickly from a large section of the support if we don't get off to a good start.

 

But for some, both he and SDM are above any reproach because they delivered 9 in a row.

 

I really don't see how 9IAR factors in, and I don't think many see SDM or WS as above reproach.

 

You only have to look at Walter's last year and a half with a bit of objectivity to see that his criticism is disproportionate.

 

In fact I find it strange that you seem to think that the defenders of Walter are somehow "less thoughtful" and using more preconceptions than his critics. I would say it's the other way around.

 

It seems to me that those who won't forgive Walter for failing to deliver 10 in a row or for not delivering more European success, think that he is beyond redemption and beyond praise - or even a fair crack at the whip.

 

It's ironic that his detractors are in fact using his previous tenure as the stick to beat him with.

 

I think he should be judged on his last one and a half season's, and looked at objectively, I can't see where the criticism is due. His only objectively measurable "failure" was to lose the league in the last week when his team were forced to play so many important games in such a short time.

 

If he had won the league, his record would have been impeccable. I am presuming most people defending Walter are using those metrics to judge him. Any loyalty to him is not blind and people will be quick to change their minds if he has a fiasco of a season.

 

To me, a highly experienced and qualified manager is only worthy of the type of fans criticism that Walter is getting when they have failed badly - like Eck and Le Guen - and also Advocaat for his last two seasons.

 

Since Walter's return he has gained 3pts more in the league than his rivals and won all the domestic cups he has entered. Add to that a decent showing the CL and a great UEFA run to the final and it's hard to see why he's currently the most criticised manager in Scotland.

 

To me all the criticism is pure subjective and also a bit early. People say he hasn't signed a midfielder but surely the "truth" is that he hasn't signed a midfielder "yet"? It's like accusing someone of being late, a few hours before they have to be somewhere.

[calscot 0]

I think all fans know its only pre season and nothing gets decided here. But the frustration is coming from the fact Ferguson got injured yet no midfielders have been brought in despite the need for 1 or 2 before Ferguson got injured.

 

Add the addition of the strikers and then the concentration of buying a defender the fans are scratching our heads about how we are going to line up next season.

 

Again, I think it's best to wait till the transfer window closes. Fans are being highly presumptions and incredibly naive about our transfer dealings. We are not privy to the ongoing negotiations and search for players - and neither are the press which was only last week shown in dramatic fashion with the signing of a defender "out of the blue."

 

Walter may have tried and been unable to progress the signings of quite a few players for all we know, and we do actually know about the protracted attempt to sign Davis, and when we're offering �£3M, it's obvious that it has to be properly concluded one way or another before we can approach an alternative or even know how much we have to spend.

 

Some fans seem to think that buying players is like shopping at Argos...

[calscot 0]

Personally, I'd sack Smith now. I've felt like that since the day he was appointed.

 

OK, we now know where your coming from. Walter can obviously do nothing right in your eyes... Anything you say about him from now on is obviously tainted by that agenda.

[Guest dirtybill]

Found this post on another forum, im all for waiting to see what the season brings but this is scary

 

WHAT EVERTON FANS THOUGHT OF WALTER SMITH - SCARY READING AS IT MIRRORS EXACTLY WHAT WE ARE SEEING NOW

 

When the end finally came, it felt like a blessed release for everyone, except perhaps the players � who were possibly still toeing the line closely defined by disciplinarian side-kick, Archie Knox and his baseball bat. The football under Walter Smith was never stellar but it had now become unspeakably bad; the results were simply atrocious; the performance, motivation, organization and enthusiasm of the players perhaps the worst indictment of a four-season fiasco that ultimately took Everton precisely nowhere.

Firstly, let's look at the positive things Walter Smith brought to Everton:

 

He represented the club in a reasonable manner ââ?¬â?? albeit in a dour manner

He never conducted himself in an embarrassing, excuse-making, referee-slagging manner (like Ferguson, O'Neill etc)

He had a dry, sharp sense of humour.

He was also a very well respected name in football.

He won a lot in Scotland, no matter how easy it is to do so, or how much help he was given.

He bought a fair number of players that had good reputations.

But, by the end of his third season, 3 years into the Goodison hot-seat (aka: the poisoned chalice!), Walter Smith was under unprecedented pressure:

 

Everton were playing utterly awful football with little spirit or creativity.

Despite injuries, the available players appeared to be poorly prepared for each match.

The 4-5-1 experiment had mostly been a complete disaster.

Smith had a bizarre aversion to playing wingers, despite having Tal and Alexandersson.

The policy of buying aging injured players had backfired badly. So where did that leave Walter Smith? Well, Bill Kenwright made it very clear that Walter Smith was going nowhere... and Kenwright's determination to stand behind the manager deserved some grudging respect. Kenwright appeared prepared to give Smith plenty of time to turn things around, and a good start to the 2001-02 season almost had everyone believing. But of course it didn't happen....

 

When he was appointed, Rangers fans were invited to comment on their knowledge of him:

 

Good motivator

Gets team playing together

Determined and competitive

Unlikely to publicly criticise players ââ?¬â?? but murders them in private, if necessary

Carries a grudge to the grave

Will NEVER change his mind or admit he's wrong

Usually good at basic organisation and team structure

Tactically clueless

Needs a strong control over his spending

Buys players on reports and videos without seeing them himself

Very poor relationship with young players

Attempts to establish a steady regular team selection

The similarities between Rangers-Smith and Everton-Smith were frightening... but they should come as no surprise: people do not change; the old dog was not receptive to learning any new tricks. In his third season at Goodison, his inadequacies only become even more glaring:

 

He could not decide on a formation and basic system of playing.

He failed to play most of the players in their best position. He could not ensure that each player understood the team plan and his particular role within it.

He was blatantly incapable of getting the players fit.

Smith's third and fourth terms were hammered by injuries ââ?¬â? this is beyond debate. But his supporters still claimed that the true mettle of the man could only be judged when he had a full squad at his disposal. However, this is football: there are ALWAYS some injured players unavailable for selection. A manager must accept that and get on with the job, rather than continually recycling this excuse for consistently poor performances ââ?¬â?? performances that fall a long way short of the standards expected at Everton FC.

 

In the 1999-2000 season, with most of the Everton squad fit, Smith took them to the giddy heights of 6th in the Premiership before injuries to Jeffers and Campbell began to bite deep. Smith then made a dreadful mistake in buying that once-great player, Mark Hughes. The success until those injuries does indicate that, with the right circumstances, Walter could perhaps do something useful at Everton.... up to a point!

 

With the right circumstances, Walter Smith seemed capable of taking Everton to the middle section of the Premiership but not much further. It was as if he needed the services of a head coach of real subtlety and skill. This all assumed that the rumours about poor morale, lack of communications, dreadful fitness, diet and conditioning regimes at Everton could all be dismissed... That brought in to question the effectiveness of the coaching staff ââ?¬â?? including our playing legend and hero, Dave Watson, before he moved across the Mersey to manage Tranmere. But, based on consistently poor Everton performances, no defence was possible; there were no excuses ââ?¬â?? Everton under Walter Smith were simply dreadful!

 

A manager should have at least three years to really establish himself and impose his style on the team, to get his players on board and have them playing together. That formula means Smith should really have been shown the door at the end of the 2000-01 season. Arguably, the volatile situation of Club ownership and parlous Club finances robbed Smith of his first two years, but the fact that this impediment had no effect on the next two identically bad years proves the lie in that weak excuse.

 

There comes a time when patience has run its course and a change must be made, irrespective of the possible benefits that stability in management may bring. Looking back over Walter Smith's tenure, there have been many, many puzzling incidents and trends that have taxed the patience of the Everton faithful to breaking point. Some forgettable low-lights from Walter's first season:

 

The failure to negotiate a deal with Hutchison, who was sorely missed.

The failure to hold on to John Collins, thought to be one of his most trusted players.

The persistence with playing strange formations (4-5-1; 5-3-2) that simply don't work for Everton.

Notts Forest (h): he played an ultra-defensive line up against the poorest team in the league.

The Dunne and Ball fiasco ââ?¬â?? disciplined for laughing at a joke on the coach home.

The list for Season 1999-2000 was just as long and puzzling:

 

The Slaven Bilic situation, where he was allowed to go home to Croatia when injured ââ?¬â?? Smith deciding the World Cup semi-finalist wasn't good enough for Everton

Relying on the efforts of 38-year-old Richard Gough in defence, which crumbles when he gets injured

Michael Branch introduced from nowhere in the Anfield derby ââ?¬â?? to disastrous effect.

David Unsworth played in midfield!!!

Defenders playing deep to protect a slow defence, creating virtually nothing as a result.

Everton taking the field with 5 centre-halfs, or 7 defenders!!!

Considered Mark Hughes as a reasonable signing.

Narrowing the pitch!!!

Displaying no tactical awareness whatsoever.

Reputed dire words to the young players for their every mistake.

The loss of Olivier Dacourt and Marco Materazzi in the summer of 1999 ââ?¬â?? after just one season ââ?¬â?? proved to set a pattern for Smith's management, where the revolving door of transfers in and out succeeded in creating instability that was bizarrely used as a reason for Smith's lack of success! Materazzi was superb in the second half of the season, except for some problems against Sheffield Wednesday. Dacourt looked class but pulled the ultimate mercenary stunt in the end. And perhaps Walter Smith himself (and his obvious limitations as an effective manager) was part of the reason why player turnover was so ridiculously high.

 

Walter had clearly lost all his enthusiasm by the end of that season. If he'd gone after ensuring our survival, he could have kept some dignity. By the end, nearly all the fans were fed up of him, while the know-nothing pundits and journalists were defending him almost to a man.

Perhaps Walter Smith's lasting legacy was this: offered the choice of David Ginola or Jay-Jay Okcha, which did he choose? And why? Of course, it was Ginola, and the reason was that his salary would be heavily sponsored by Aston Villa � just to get him off their books � while Okacha went on to have a great twilight career with Bolton Wanderers.

 

[Cotter 0]

Personally, I'd sack Smith now. I've felt like that since the day he was appointed.

 

 

Did you feel like that when Nacho scored that penalty against Fiorentina?:admin:

[Gribz 743]

Again, I think it's best to wait till the transfer window closes. Fans are being highly presumptions and incredibly naive about our transfer dealings.

...

 

But qualifying for the CL is well over by the end of the transfer window and what if its too late???

 

Id say its more naive of WS to fix or not even address the midfield problem last out of the 3 outfield positions, while Ferguson was injured and after the CL qualifier.