Dave King to Sell Shares to Club 1872

[rbr 1,270]

And one more little point just to highlight the sheer hypocrisy of club1872 s board , guess which newspaper , the one that they have campaigned against for years , was invited to the launch yesterday . Couldnt mark their necks with a blow torch . 

[Stevie - 4lads Blog 922]

49 minutes ago, Bluedell said:

Arguably raising £13m and paying it into the club, rather than paying it to Dave King, makes a repeat of 2012 less likely.

 

Dave King will be looking for £5.4m from the club in 10 months, and there is all the other funding that's required. Where is that coming from?

 

That £13m is cash that could help the club become more financially secure and help it back on its feet. Why is it sad for people to take that view?

The negativity I referred to is the sniping against 1872

 

Sometimes looking beyond that is necessary to achieve a goal 

 

Are they perfect? No I don’t think so but I haven’t found that 

 

Why should King walk away with nothing? He has went above and beyond and perhaps conditions were he was entitled to this funds back? 
 

My view is I’m prepared to back it and get the answers I’m looking for from them, I’ll also make sure everyone sees them as well 

[Stevie - 4lads Blog 922]

20 minutes ago, rbr said:

Stevie , the negativity around this has been caused by Club 1872 themselves , they treat it as their own little North Korean empire , I haven't had a single email from them in nearly 2 years , I've emailed them on numerous occasions regarding the next AGM with no replies , today I've had 3 separate emails begging for money .

 

Their inability to deal with their own governance , their inability to deal with previous issues such as the bullying of board members , their ties to James "the snake" Blair our slithering company secretary , all go against them .

 

I was a massive supporter of fan ownership , however this is simply a step too far , the consequences and responsibilities that come with having such a massive percentage far out weighs any benefits in the short term , and as a support I honestly don't see how we could even come close to not only raising the required funds but meet any future funding requirements , or would we just not be needed and it would be left to the other shareholders , I don't think so .

Perhaps you have an issue with those things, I’ve never found that and I don’t say that to be a dick, I just haven’t had those issues 

 

I’m in favour of fan ownership, much like pushing fan media. It’s our club 

 

I accept they aren’t perfect, I’m not telling you that or dismissing your points 

 

I’m not looking for an argument, I’m saying I believe in the concept 

 

I am looking for answers on stuff, I believe I can get them to share for everyone 

 

So we’ll see how it goes 

[Bluedell 5,679]

2 minutes ago, Stevie - 4lads Blog said:

Why should King walk away with nothing? He has went above and beyond and perhaps conditions were he was entitled to this funds back? 

 

 

He doesn't walk away with nothing. He walks away with shares that he says are worth £33m.

 

Your comment that he is entitled to get his funds back doesn't make sense to me. Why convert the loans into shares if that was the case. Are you suggesting that C1872 agreed to this purchase years ago, and the board of C1872 have withheld this information from the members? 

 

As for going above and beyond, I thought he had, but he's now wanting to get most of his cash back, which he's entitled to do, but:

1. It takes away from that assertion.

2. As a member of C1872, I believe that the cash raised should be for the financial benefit of the club and not repaying third parties.

[Stevie - 4lads Blog 922]

Just now, Bluedell said:

He doesn't walk away with nothing. He walks away with shares that he says are worth £33m.

 

Your comment that he is entitled to get his funds back doesn't make sense to me. Why convert the loans into shares if that was the case. Are you suggesting that C1872 agreed to this purchase years ago, and the board of C1872 have withheld this information from the members? 

 

As for going above and beyond, I thought he had, but he's now wanting to get most of his cash back, which he's entitled to do, but:

1. It takes away from that assertion.

2. As a member of C1872, I believe that the cash raised should be for the financial benefit of the club and not repaying third parties.

If you think the club should benefit from the £13m then he walks away with nothing 

 

Why should he do that? 
 

I’m not suggesting anything, you are doing all that yourself 

 

I’m not looking for an argument, your entitled to your opinion. My own is that King has sacrificed a lot, if he wants that back and has cut this deal then I’m ok with it. He’s done enough to earn that and was there when we needed him

 

I wouldn’t expect Parks to do differently 

 

However I will get the answers and share them as I have questions myself, you aren’t saying anything wrong, I just think differently but given the opportunity I will ask 

[rbr 1,270]

1 hour ago, Stevie - 4lads Blog said:

Perhaps you have an issue with those things, I’ve never found that and I don’t say that to be a dick, I just haven’t had those issues 

 

I’m in favour of fan ownership, much like pushing fan media. It’s our club 

 

I accept they aren’t perfect, I’m not telling you that or dismissing your points 

 

I’m not looking for an argument, I’m saying I believe in the concept 

 

I am looking for answers on stuff, I believe I can get them to share for everyone 

 

So we’ll see how it goes 

Stevie , I attended every meeting and every hustings when the initial elections took place , I watched as the club themselves pushed certain individuals through the press and backed them to the detriment of others , at these meetings laterally board members lied to us the members , James Blair had an absolute nighmare where he couldn,t  remember a conversation that a board member that was being bullied and threatend took to him only 2 weeks prior to this meeting , yet 30 minutes later repeated word for word a cobversation from over a year earlier .

 

This does nothing in the bigger picture for Rangers , I agree Dave King is owed a huge debt of gratitude , but this level of ownership brings responsibilities that financially the support simly cannot live up to and its not being spelled out .That is extremly worrying .

 

The message is that we will own this vast amount of Rangers stock yet have no financial responsibility going forward , we cant get a fan on the board from Club1872 due to conflicts of interest and business confidentiality , so what do we do regards that issue .Have someone on the board that cant answer questions or pass on information , its a recipe for disaster .

Edited December 2, 2020 by rbr

[Bluedell 5,679]

42 minutes ago, Stevie - 4lads Blog said:

If you think the club should benefit from the £13m then he walks away with nothing 

 

Why should he do that? 
 

I’m not suggesting anything, you are doing all that yourself 

 

I’m not looking for an argument, your entitled to your opinion. My own is that King has sacrificed a lot, if he wants that back and has cut this deal then I’m ok with it. He’s done enough to earn that and was there when we needed him

 

I wouldn’t expect Parks to do differently 

 

However I will get the answers and share them as I have questions myself, you aren’t saying anything wrong, I just think differently but given the opportunity I will ask 

I'm suggesting that if C1872 are able to raise £13m then that should go to the club for new shares. King still walks away with shares that he says are worth £33m and not nothing. Why are you saying he's walking away with nothing if C1872 don't buy the shares when that isn't true?

 

You said that there were "perhaps conditions were he was entitled to this funds back." Who are you suggesting that he entered this agreement with where there were conditions if it wasn't C1872?

 

Ultimately if you wish to give Dave King your hard-earned rather than it going to the club then it's your choice and you're free to do so, but I just don't get why people would want to do it. It's a debate rather than an argument, mate, and C1872 should be encouraging more debates as to what happens.

 

C1872 should be giving its members a choice of whether the cash raised goes to King or the club, but they won't. It'll be the normal 'yes' or 'no' on the King deal and avoid giving the members a real choice. I'm frustrated with the current 3 board members and one shadow director are making all the major decisions and then presenting them to the members as a fait accompli. We're not talking about a small project of funding of a season ticket. We're talking about £13m of fan's money and there's been no consultation and no AGMs or on-line votes where we can make our feelings known.

[Stevie - 4lads Blog 922]

1 minute ago, Bluedell said:

I'm suggesting that if C1872 are able to raise £13m then that should go to the club for new shares. King still walks away with shares that he says are worth £33m and not nothing. Why are you saying he's walking away with nothing if C1872 don't buy the shares when that isn't true?

 

You said that there were "perhaps conditions were he was entitled to this funds back." Who are you suggesting that he entered this agreement with where there were conditions if it wasn't C1872?

 

Ultimately if you wish to give Dave King your hard-earned rather than it going to the club then it's your choice and you're free to do so, but I just don't get why people would want to do it. It's a debate rather than an argument, mate, and C1872 should be encouraging more debates as to what happens.

 

C1872 should be giving its members a choice of whether the cash raised goes to King or the club, but they won't. It'll be the normal 'yes' or 'no' on the King deal and avoid giving the members a real choice. I'm frustrated with the current 3 board members and one shadow director are making all the major decisions and then presenting them to the members as a fait accompli. We're not talking about a small project of funding of a season ticket. We're talking about £13m of fan's money and there's been no consultation and no AGMs or on-line votes where we can make our feelings known.

Again your tone is completely harsh when I made a simple post on the matter 

 

I said that because I asked perhaps his family said he has to get something back, perhaps the club knew it was a loan, it was a question which is a reasonable one you have drawn assumptions on. I asked it to speculate that perhaps it was always known he would need it back 

 

I’m not looking for an argument with you or @rbr, Indeed I have said you both make fair and good points. I have acknowledged it isn’t perfect 

 

However I believe in the concept of fan ownership, Rangers can not depend on people bailing us out. We have to have a business model

 

It’s selfish to expect that to continue forever, I don’t expect Park or Bennett to walk away with nothing either 

 

I am not as knowledgeable as you both, but I have a very simplistic view

 

However, I have questions to ask, I will seek to have then answered and share them on my platform very soon.

 

I don’t think anything anyone is saying is unfair either with regards to both your points 

 

I don’t think I am either! 

[Tannochsidebear 2,429]

The whole point of C1872 members giving them money for share purchases is to put the money into the club. Not to send this money away to South Africa never to be seen or benefitted from again. If King wants to sell his shares and can make a profit on them, then he should do so, and we would expect him to have the integrity to not sell to an outsider with no love for the club. That in itself is a big ask but there you are, we are a demanding bunch and he knows that full well.

 

If we think what the club could do with £13M of new money, it could well set us up for the next couple of years, ensure we only have to sell 1 or 2 players instead of more, perhaps allow us to strengthen further, or to invest in our stadium and facilities. I would 100% back any investment where the money goes to the club directly. I will have no part of a legacy where the only legacy is King riding off into the sunset with his "investment" back at the expense of the fans.

 

 

[rbr 1,270]

23 minutes ago, Stevie - 4lads Blog said:

Again your tone is completely harsh when I made a simple post on the matter 

 

I said that because I asked perhaps his family said he has to get something back, perhaps the club knew it was a loan, it was a question which is a reasonable one you have drawn assumptions on. I asked it to speculate that perhaps it was always known he would need it back 

 

I’m not looking for an argument with you or @rbr, Indeed I have said you both make fair and good points. I have acknowledged it isn’t perfect 

 

However I believe in the concept of fan ownership, Rangers can not depend on people bailing us out. We have to have a business model

 

It’s selfish to expect that to continue forever, I don’t expect Park or Bennett to walk away with nothing either 

 

I am not as knowledgeable as you both, but I have a very simplistic view

 

However, I have questions to ask, I will seek to have then answered and share them on my platform very soon.

 

I don’t think anything anyone is saying is unfair either with regards to both your points 

 

I don’t think I am either! 

Stevie , appologies for the tone of my replies , Ive been reading stuff on other forums and on twitter and the amount of ignorance on this subject is staggering .

 

I agree 100% regards DK and his situation , its a very complex issue that no one really apartb from him understands fully , infact there was much conjecture around the time he stepped down , why he stepped down ,and this regularity issue with SARS and his inability to get money out of SA was given as one possible reason .

 

The issues I have with Club1872 from a governance stance are valid IMHO , even more so when we havent had a members meeting in over 2 years and the board elections were changed with very little info again at short notice to a period I believe of 3 years .

 

Again I fuklly agree that the business model must change to a sustainable one , but the finacial guarentees that would be required of a 25% shareholder , in a multi million pound comopany are huge and Club 1872 cannot guarentee to meet these requirements leading to dilutiion of share possibly amongst other things , also the question of getting fan representation on the board is ludicris , anyone from Club 1872 that managed to get on the board would be under the same restraints as the current board members , can you imagine the furore if there are questions that need asked in a situation that may arise and the Club1872 /board member cannot answer them because of confidentiality issues .

 

Good luck to them but it will never happen without a sugar daddy coming on board , if they had the nmoney required they could simply have went to DK and got the shares themselves .