Koeverman

[Guest Sutton_Blows_Goats]

But Gribz.... did Celtic not make sell Petrov off for a tidy sum ? And he was also playing at Celtic. I think that Brown has as much potential as Petrov had (but maybe I am blinkered).

 

I agree that the SPL gets held to ransom because of the quality of the league and its standing (was going to say the very same thing to Pete the other day when he mentioned Huntelaar, how much he cost Ajax and how much he would now command - he wouldn't command nearly as much if he had been at Rangers).

 

But I think that Celtic could easily make profit on Brown in a couple of years time - he will have more exposure due to Europe and internationals. It is all hearsay for now but I would rather look at the bigger picture and what we could eventually see (sell a player for profit) as opposed to dealing in the bargain basement, make no money and then likely have to buy out their contracts, as has happened to us so many times in the past.

 

Elmander is a good example of what I am getting at - and Huntelaar would be too. Quality is permanent and these guys would have made us a better team, gotten more exposure for themselves and possibly moved on at profit. Where we are dealing that isn't too likely.

 

 

Agree, A great example of a club like that is PSV, over the years they have sold on a ton of players for a massive profit, Romario, Ronaldo, Cocu, van Nistelrooij. Alex, Gomes and Farfan could well be next.

 

We should be following that model, there is throwing money away like we did under advocaat, but don;t forget, if we are prudent enough, and we speculate to accumulate properly and not waste money on 30 y.o ducthmen and italians we coudl perk up financially.

[craig 5,199]

That is the thing, SDM is scared shitless to spend ANY money which actually hinders us both on AND off the pitch.

 

If we had a policy of bringing through youth or speculating on young guys like Brown and Naismith then it could ultimately BENEFIT our financial state because if you tie up 21 or 22 yr old guys on long term deals on reasonable wages then 3 or 4 yrs into a 5 yr contract you could cash in on them in a market which is likely to be as bouyant as it is now, at least in England with the TV cash.

 

These guys at 21 or 22 yrs old will only be BETTER players by then in a better team and have more exposure.

 

An example...

 

Brown - cost 4.4 million - 4 yrs later he has helped you win trophies, sell for 6 mill (not unreasonable in my opinion)

 

Naismith - cost 2 million - 4 yrs later helped you win trophies, sell for 4-5 million - again not unreasonable in my opinion.

 

So excluding wages you have just made profit of 3.6-4.6 million in 4 yrs whilst also having their services.

 

Again, I know this is hearsay but I dont think those numbers are unreasonable.

 

Yet our custodian is afraid to spend ANY money, which leaves us shopping the bargain basement. ZERO forward thinking from the powers that be at Ibrox.

 

Look at Celtic and how much money they have made from Nakamura from shirt sales alone - again, even if he wasnt a first team player he would have been a good squad player and his fee would have been paid in merchandising sales. Forward thinking from Celtic whilst we are being managed/led by fear.

[calscot 0]

I get your point, but...

 

Not sure Naismith will be worth 4M. How much is Boyd worth now? 1.5M? He was considered better than Naismith.

 

How much is Thomson worth? No more than what we paid for him is my guess, maybe less.

 

Brown will have to establish himself and show something special to appreciate in value. Barry Ferguson was 6M but he had a fantastic couple of seasons and showed his metal in Europe against the likes of Parma (at their best) and a decent Leverkusen.

 

I'm starting to doubt that players in Scotland are worth much elsewhere. They rarely go to Europe and the richer the EPL gets, the more they unfairly see us as equivalent to Div 1.

 

Your point has validity but to follow that road we might be better off with the best young English players as they sell for way over the odds - except we can't afford them in the first place...

[calscot 0]

As for Nakamura, I agree and was disappointed the rumour about Inamoto signing came to nought - except I've heard he's pants now.

 

This is the kind of thinking we need if we want to hang on the coat tails of the rich leagues.

[craig 5,199]

I get your point, but...

 

Not sure Naismith will be worth 4M. How much is Boyd worth now? 1.5M? He was considered better than Naismith.

 

How much is Thomson worth? No more than what we paid for him is my guess, maybe less.

 

Brown will have to establish himself and show something special to appreciate in value. Barry Ferguson was 6M but he had a fantastic couple of seasons and showed his metal in Europe against the likes of Parma (at their best) and a decent Leverkusen.

 

I'm starting to doubt that players in Scotland are worth much elsewhere. They rarely go to Europe and the richer the EPL gets, the more they unfairly see us as equivalent to Div 1.

 

Your point has validity but to follow that road we might be better off with the best young English players as they sell for way over the odds - except we can't afford them in the first place...

 

Was there not talk of a Russian outfit offering us multiple millions for Boyd ? I am pretty sure we could get more than 1.5 million for Boyd given that Tony Stokes went to Sunderland (whilst still a Champ side) for 2 million.

 

Naismith and Boyd are different players and Naismith is younger. I am not sure if Boyd is a better player or not, havent seen enough of Naismith. I think Naismith has a fair amount of potential, otherwise why would Arsenal bother taking him on trial and why would they have favourable reviews on him ?

 

Agreed Re Brown but there is also nothing (other than his temperament) to suggest he CAN'T establish himself - he apparently (I never saw the game) produced something quite special when introduced against the Italians (albeit for only half a game) but it shows he has the ability to be special.

 

I dont see your rationale for having the best young English players though - they would still be plying their trade in the SPL and, according to your theory, as I read it, is that being in the SPL stifles their value - so why pay over the odds for a good young English player when his value would immediately fall as he has just come to the SPL ?

 

The one common theme though is that whilst our friends from the East side of the city are prepared to take chances on good, raw, young talent - we are scraping the barrel with Bosmans and not chancing anything on transfer fees.

 

I would much rather be in their position if they get Naismith to add to Scott Brown than ours. And I would rather have BOTH those players in our squad as opposed to theirs.

[craig 5,199]

As for Nakamura, I agree and was disappointed the rumour about Inamoto signing came to nought - except I've heard he's pants now.

 

This is the kind of thinking we need if we want to hang on the coat tails of the rich leagues.

 

Sadly it makes less of a difference to us now, given our fearless leader has sold the merchandising rights of the club over to JJB. Only after certain thresholds have been met would such a signing be to our benefit.

 

Again, sadly, our friends seem to have more forward thinking than we do and are breaking into new markets whilst we either stagnate or contract !

[ascender 352]

Thing is though, spending maybe over the odds, or the market rate as it is known in the football world, isn't a problem if you minimise the risk. The problem is that DM seems to have gone from one extreme to the other. None of us want to go back to the days where he risks the future of the club by overspending on transfer fees and wages, but we now seem to be in an era where he wants to spend as little as possible on fees.

 

Which just isn't possible. Especially when you're competing with a club who do seem willing to pay the going rate for players at the moment. Celtic seem keen to use their CL revenue to strengthen their squad while also strengthening their brand image abroad. Like it or not, they seem to be way ahead of us off the park and if they continue to add to their squad, I fear the title will be written off again. There's no point matching Celtic 4 times a season if we don't have a strong enough squad to get results against the other teams across the year.

 

DM could prove me wrong, but I'm really worried for the immediate future of the club. This downsizing has lasted much longer than anyone thought and without a serious cash investment, we are in danger of finishing second in the SPL for the foreseeable future. How can there be so little money to spend on fees for players given how much has been cut from the wage bill and recouped in transfers?

 

If DM really does care about the club as much as he says, he'll spend the summer making serious funds available to WS, or actively try to sell the club to people who want to see us doing well on and off the pitch.

 

A few of us have been saying that the next few months are maybe the most important for our club in the last 25 years or so, but I'm starting to think that even that was an underestimation of just how grim things are for us, both on and off the pitch.

[Leppardized2001 0]

What we need to be doing is improving our scouting network so that we can sign the very best of Scottish/British/European young talent before they reach the radar of most of the big clubs. The fact that Ewan Chester is now back in the set-up disappoints me as he didn't seem to spot much young talent first time around.

 

Even if we have to pay a significant transfer fee to land an outstanding prospect eg Gio Van Bronckhosrt. With teams in the Premiership and Championship looking more and more to the SPL, the opportunity is there for us to take on a player for a season or 2 and then sell him on for a good profit. If we could make £2-3million profit on 1 player every couple of seasons that would provide you with funds to sign a few quality free transfers or bosmans.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Malky