match thread (image) [FT] Villarreal 2 - 2 Rangers (Arfield 67; Lafferty 76)

[Rousseau 10,600]

14 minutes ago, DMAA said:

By the way, we've discussed modern styles vs tradtional styles before and I think Chris Burke would struggle to break through today because people don't fancy an out and out winger these days. For me the game hasn't changed as much as people say it has and fast wingers who'll beat a full back and get to the by-line will always be a full back's worst nightmare and create lots of goals.

It's certainly a huge threat, but it's not enough if that's all he does. That muppet James McClean comes to mind, unfortunately; all he does is run at defenders, but it's easy enough to deal with; it only really works towards the end of games.  

 

It's a really good weapon to have, but players need more nowadays, IMO.

[Walterbear 557]

I think Kent and Middleton are 2 different kinds of players. Kent is more effective inside and linking middle and front but has trickery and he puts in a shift.

 

Middleton is more direct out wide and a great crosser but doesn’t have same all round game as Kent. If you know you need to get good balls in the box and don’t have much time to do it then Middleton is reliable.  

 

I think Kent starting is probably SG style and Middleton as impact - for now. 

 

Incidentally the clever aspect of the second goal last night was the Barisic run. He started and finished it from well off the touchline so there was a big channel for Middleton to play the ball down (superb pass) , but also that ball down that space meant the central VR defence could not cut it out as it was down the line and lafferty was occupying them and also because of Barisic position of run meaning the VR right defender had come in off the touchline to pick him up. Looks like that tactic came off the training ground. 

 

Credit to SG for turning the game round. Great point he also made about the lesson of the game is watch the second half and start to believe in yourself. Football is about being as good as you can and maintaining or improving even on that. Before SG our club was full of fear and that was infecting us/me as fans. That fear is going and this result will give massive self belief to the team. The scum would have lost in VR. 

 

 

Edited September 21, 2018 by Walterbear

[Bill 13,717]

3 hours ago, Rousseau said:

I thought Worral was good. He looks a solid unit, but was also very comfortable on the ball.

 

Is he left-footed?

 

I wonder if our CB pairing could have been Katic (right-footed?) and Worral (left)? 

 

However, I think Goldson is the leader in defence so he'll be first choice. 

I hope this is simply about arriving at the position of having three players sharing the burden of two positions and not a case of having preferences and pecking orders. I also thought Worral looked good last night and brings an aggression and physicality that might be invaluable in the Scottish game. He looks to have a bit of a warrior mentality and I don't think he's going to be easily bullied by opposition forwards. 

[der Berliner 3,743]

You do wonder where Grezda will fit in, for methinks he was utilized as a left (and right) winger by Osijek, playing with Barisic. That would leave Middleton as the impact player and probably Kent moving inside. Where we have Arfield, Ejaria and Dorrans now to fill the attacking MF areas. It is good to have these options, but one feels a bit awkward, given that our permanent players may still make way for the loanees from Merseyside ...

[DMAA 3,658]

2 hours ago, Rousseau said:

True, but he can still be raw if that's all he can do

But it's an assumption that it is all he can do. He's only been given cameos so far and it seems clear he's been asked to do this.

 

But from the evidence of youth games he's a much more rounded and talented player. Last night's through ball was no surprise to me, he's not just a new Gregg Wylde. Clips of him playing for Scotland youth and Norwich youth shows him deployed on the right and able to cut inside as well as having a fantastic shot (both right and left foot).

 

Defensive discipline is something he may be weak with, but I just don't buy the idea that we need someone starting on the left who will run inside and pass back to the defence (which Kent does constantly). Middleton is the kind of winger you want centre mids coming towards and playing a one-two down the line with allowing him to get where we want our winger, in behind the full backs. Man City were doing this constantly last season with Sane and Sterling. We need our wingers in the cut-back position in behind, which is where we got both our goals last night.

 

 

Edited September 21, 2018 by DMAA

[der Berliner 3,743]

These guys at bet365 seem to have taken to us ...

 

Quote

 

Villarreal spent over £50m last year. Only Barcelona, Atletico Madrid, Real Madrid and Valencia finished above them in La Liga last season.

 

Gerard Moreno cost £18 million

Karl Toko Ekambi cost £16 million

Nicola Sansone cost £12 million

Ramiro Funes Mori cost £8 million

Carlos Bacca cost £7 million

 

The entire Rangers starting XI cost £6 million

 

Full time - Villarreal 2-2 Rangers

 

Croatia? Completed it.

Slovenia? Sound.

Macedonia? Made it through.

Russia? Really didn't need more than 9.

 

Spain? See you at Ibrox.

 

Steven Gerrard's Rangers go their 9th game in Europe without defeat

 

Concede after 45 seconds - pull themselves level. Go behind for a second time in the match - pull themselves level again.

Steven Gerrard's Rangers don't know when they're beat in Europe.

 

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/bet365/status/1042851588459638786

 

 

[JohnMc 2,750]

46 minutes ago, DMAA said:

But it's an assumption that it is all he can do. He's only been given cameos so far and it seems clear he's been asked to do this.

 

But from the evidence of youth games he's a much more rounded and talented player. Last night's through ball was no surprise to me, he's not just a new Gregg Wylde. Clips of him playing for Scotland youth and Norwich youth shows him deployed on the right and able to cut inside as well as having a fantastic shot (both right and left foot).

 

Defensive discipline is something he may be weak with, but I just don't buy the idea that we need someone starting on the left who will run inside and pass back to the defence (which Kent does constantly). Middleton is the kind of winger you want centre mids coming towards and playing a one-two down the line with allowing him to get where we want our winger, in behind the full backs. Man City were doing this constantly last season with Sane and Sterling. We need our wingers in the cut-back position in behind, which is where we got both our goals last night.

 

 

Gerrard himself said Middleton needs to learn about positioning out of possession as well as a number of other things. It's always exciting when a young Scottish attacking player makes an impression on the side, it happens rarely enough after all. But I agree with those who say he's raw, I don't think he's ready for a starting place yet, he only joined the first team squad a matter of weeks ago. Gerrard's use of him has impressed, there's very little pressure on him coming on as a sub, the crowd are less likely to get on his back if he loses the ball (the Ibrox crowd are unforgiving even to young players), he can use his freshness against defenders who might be tiring or carrying a caution and all the time he's learning. 

 

In the end over the course of the season he might well be required to start a match, suspensions and injuries will happen, so he'll get a chance at some point. 

[Rousseau 10,600]

1 hour ago, DMAA said:

But it's an assumption that it is all he can do. He's only been given cameos so far and it seems clear he's been asked to do this.

 

But from the evidence of youth games he's a much more rounded and talented player. Last night's through ball was no surprise to me, he's not just a new Gregg Wylde. Clips of him playing for Scotland youth and Norwich youth shows him deployed on the right and able to cut inside as well as having a fantastic shot (both right and left foot).

 

Defensive discipline is something he may be weak with, but I just don't buy the idea that we need someone starting on the left who will run inside and pass back to the defence (which Kent does constantly). Middleton is the kind of winger you want centre mids coming towards and playing a one-two down the line with allowing him to get where we want our winger, in behind the full backs. Man City were doing this constantly last season with Sane and Sterling. We need our wingers in the cut-back position in behind, which is where we got both our goals last night.

 

 

I'm not sure what we're debating?

 

He probably deserves a start. He is a good young player; refreshing and exciting. 

 

I still think he's raw, almost one-dimensional, from what I've seen thus far. That is partly due to the fact he's only had cameos, but I can only base my opinion on what I've seen. 

 

I think we tend to jump the gun somewhat with our youngsters. He's done well, very well, when he's come on, but that doesn't mean he's ready to be a regular starter. He needs to get better at the link-up, knowing when and not to take on his man, covering and tracking back, and positioning and runs off and with the ball etc. To be fair, he'll need starts to develop that; late cameos don't help him in that regard.  

[buster. 5,183]

23 minutes ago, Rousseau said:

I'm not sure what we're debating?

 

He probably deserves a start. He is a good young player; refreshing and exciting. 

 

I still think he's raw, almost one-dimensional, from what I've seen thus far. That is partly due to the fact he's only had cameos, but I can only base my opinion on what I've seen. 

 

I think we tend to jump the gun somewhat with our youngsters. He's done well, very well, when he's come on, but that doesn't mean he's ready to be a regular starter. He needs to get better at the link-up, knowing when and not to take on his man, covering and tracking back, and positioning and runs off and with the ball etc. To be fair, he'll need starts to develop that; late cameos don't help him in that regard.  

We won't really know his current level until he gets more of games.

 

Excellent or exceptional young players tend to be ready at 18, most of our youngsters haven't been because they haven't been exceptional. Middleton has earned a start, whether that be against St.Johnstone or Ayr Utd.

[Walterbear 557]

3 hours ago, der Berliner said:

You do wonder where Grezda will fit in, for methinks he was utilized as a left (and right) winger by Osijek, playing with Barisic. That would leave Middleton as the impact player and probably Kent moving inside. Where we have Arfield, Ejaria and Dorrans now to fill the attacking MF areas. It is good to have these options, but one feels a bit awkward, given that our permanent players may still make way for the loanees from Merseyside ...

Don’t forget Kent is a loan so grezda is the future. Kent and Middleton are young so having grezda and Murphy to come back is a great problem. 

 

Still think we are missing a playmaker aka carzola or hate to say it a Rogic or McGregor. Scum still ahead of us in that area but see us catching up across the other positions.