No quality, no bottle, no Progrès - Should the manager be sacked?

[pete 2,499]

One week on from our worst ever result no one has been sacked & no one has resigned.

 

Absolutely shocking

 

Don't hold your breath mate. Nobody will be sacked.

[RANGERRAB 3,677]

Don't hold your breath mate. Nobody will be sacked.

 

Very worrying indeed if that's the case. We need far higher performances targets throughout at Rangers

[Gaffer 1,665]

Don't hold your breath mate. Nobody will be sacked.

 

Nor should they be! I've had a couple of shocking days at my work in the past few months but I wouldn't expect to be sacked either. You guys really need to get a grip and stop this hysteria. We lost a game of football because one team took their two chances and we didn't take ours. We won the first game and should have been out of sight at half time. That's football.

 

As for the manager being sacked because he should make sure the players are fit .... fitness is about mental fitness too and if you're the attacking team (which we were), it takes 6-7 weeks to reach the sharpness required for this style of football (or any other for that matter). Progres should be commended because they had a game plan which relied on them putting eleven men behind the ball and keeping us out. They did it brilliantly, and it annoys me to hear them called a pub team. There are few pro teams that can keep the concentration going for as long as they did and I take my hat off to them.

[JohnMc 2,754]

Don't hold your breath mate. Nobody will be sacked.

 

That's the dilemma the board face. If they sack him now and admit he was a mistake they'll be criticised and their judgement to appoint a manager will be questioned. But on the plus side they'll have removed the problem early and have another chance to make a better appointment.

If they choose to wait until Christmas, when we're fighting for fourth, out the League Cup and playing to half full stadiums then they can say 'we gave him time and backed him but it didn't work out'. That looks better for them but next season is a write off and we've wasted 12 months.

 

I'm not some hot head who hounds a manager after a bad result. I normally plead patience. I went down with the good ship Le Guen, Bluedell might remember heated pleas to give him more time and backing on another forum at the time. I even backed McCoist because he was a club legend and held the club together during some difficult times when I felt he deserved more respect. But I can't see any reason to keep Pedro. I'm sure PC is a lovely guy but he's never good enough to manage Rangers, he simply doesn't have what it takes and the sooner he's relieved of his duties the better for both him and us because it's going to get horrible for him once the season begins. Glasgow is an unforgiving football city when things aren't going well.

[RANGERRAB 3,677]

Nor should they be! I've had a couple of shocking days at my work in the past few months but I wouldn't expect to be sacked either. You guys really need to get a grip and stop this hysteria. We lost a game of football because one team took their two chances and we didn't take ours. We won the first game and should have been out of sight at half time. That's football.

 

As for the manager being sacked because he should make sure the players are fit .... fitness is about mental fitness too and if you're the attacking team (which we were), it takes 6-7 weeks to reach the sharpness required for this style of football (or any other for that matter). Progres should be commended because they had a game plan which relied on them putting eleven men behind the ball and keeping us out. They did it brilliantly, and it annoys me to hear them called a pub team. There are few pro teams that can keep the concentration going for as long as they did and I take my hat off to them.

 

Seriously ?? Are you try to make excuses for not being able to beat Progres Niderkorn over two legs ? Okay they're not a pub team they're a village team. Is that any better ?

 

One week later & I still cannot believe or accept that result. And find it even more difficult to take that no one has taken responsibility for it within Rangers. If we want to be a big club we need to start behaving like one.

[JohnMc 2,754]

Nor should they be! I've had a couple of shocking days at my work in the past few months but I wouldn't expect to be sacked either. You guys really need to get a grip and stop this hysteria. We lost a game of football because one team took their two chances and we didn't take ours. We won the first game and should have been out of sight at half time. That's football.

 

As for the manager being sacked because he should make sure the players are fit .... fitness is about mental fitness too and if you're the attacking team (which we were), it takes 6-7 weeks to reach the sharpness required for this style of football (or any other for that matter). Progres should be commended because they had a game plan which relied on them putting eleven men behind the ball and keeping us out. They did it brilliantly, and it annoys me to hear them called a pub team. There are few pro teams that can keep the concentration going for as long as they did and I take my hat off to them.

 

Gaffer, you're not the manager of Rangers and with respect if you're comparing your job to his we're wasting our time. The manager of Rangers doesn't get to have 'shocking days', if he has one he gets criticised very publicly, if he has a few close together he gets fired, we don't accept second best and that's why we're the most successful club side in the world. You might think that's unfair, but it's reality.

 

I can probably accept losing a match, I can't accept losing the tie, that's simply unacceptable. I don't get these excuses I keep reading about lack of fitness, whether physical or mental. That's Pedro's job, if he's sending out sides that aren't mentally fit then he should be fired. There are no excuses for that, bullshit that it's harder to attack than defend, he's going to be facing a season of 10 men behind the ball in Scotland and he must surely know that by now. If we're not prepared for teams defending doggedly then we're in for a longer season than even I fear.

 

I didn't call them a pub team, but let's be clear they are a semi-pro side who finished fourth in the league of a country who are currently ranked 48th out of 55 European countries. Two of the countries below them are rocks in the sea, two are mountain tax havens and one is a war zone. They might beat the Dog and Duck first eleven on Glasgow Green on a Saturday morning but lets not pretend they are anything other than the poorest side Rangers have ever met in European football before now, because they are.

[der Berliner 3,747]

der Berliner, the fourth best team in Luxembourg! Fourth!! Not even the best side. If only you got points for hitting the post and the bar, eh? We scored one goal over 180 minutes against a side of part-timers dB, you can make your excuses in a one off match, perhaps, but not over two legs. Someone in the other thread mentioned Advocaat's first match against the Irish side. See, in that match we were losing badly at half time, again it was early in the summer, that side had not only not played together much but Advocaat had never managed them in a game that counted before, unlike Pedro he didn't get a few months to learn and plot and plan. So at half time Advocaat changed his side, changed formation, moved players about, saw how the Irish were playing and adjusted his team and tactics so that Rangers, the full-time side, ran out comfortable winners in the end. Tell me again about how PC didn't have time to prepare for this match? How long does he need to prepare a team capable of beating the side that finished more than 20 points behind the winners of the Luxembourg league?

 

If our players are "half-fit" then that alone should see PC get fired. Why are our players only half fit for the first match of the season? There can be no excuse for that, that's simply not doing the very basics of his job.

 

PC's ability is questioned because he's presided over two of the most humiliating results in over a century of playing football. You really think that's unreasonable?

 

No matter how often the same arguments are rolled up time and again. If one keeps ignoring the context of it all, you can just as well forget any debate. You want to drum on about 4th best team (they brought in 10 new players, so who knows what they are like compared to last season?), being "a Luxembourg" side, and whatnot. It changes nothing, as PC's new signings haven't made any impact as yet, the same people employed managed to miss chances just like they did last season. We missed a few sitters and they scored from their odd chances. That is football, not excuses. As I said previously, we are not playing this game alone on the park and those who qualify to play in Europe do so on merit.

 

Only time will tell how Rangers FC and PC will progres ... and I for one will wait for a while or going out all guns blazing.

[JohnMc 2,754]

No matter how often the same arguments are rolled up time and again. If one keeps ignoring the context of it all, you can just as well forget any debate. You want to drum on about 4th best team (they brought in 10 new players, so who knows what they are like compared to last season?), being "a Luxembourg" side, and whatnot. It changes nothing, as PC's new signings haven't made any impact as yet, the same people employed managed to miss chances just like they did last season. We missed a few sitters and they scored from their odd chances. That is football, not excuses. As I said previously, we are not playing this game alone on the park and those who qualify to play in Europe do so on merit.

 

Only time will tell how Rangers FC and PC will progres ... and I for one will wait for a while or going out all guns blazing.

 

Hang about dB, do you really think Progres are anything but the the worst side we've ever been drawn against in Europe? Have I misunderstood you on that? And do you feel this defeat excusable because Pedro can't be expected to organise and motivate well paid professional players to beat the worst side we've ever met because he didn't buy them? Is that the argument dB?

[craig 5,199]

Gaffer, you're not the manager of Rangers and with respect if you're comparing your job to his we're wasting our time. The manager of Rangers doesn't get to have 'shocking days', if he has one he gets criticised very publicly, if he has a few close together he gets fired, we don't accept second best and that's why we're the most successful club side in the world. You might think that's unfair, but it's reality.

 

I can probably accept losing a match, I can't accept losing the tie, that's simply unacceptable. I don't get these excuses I keep reading about lack of fitness, whether physical or mental. That's Pedro's job, if he's sending out sides that aren't mentally fit then he should be fired. There are no excuses for that, bullshit that it's harder to attack than defend, he's going to be facing a season of 10 men behind the ball in Scotland and he must surely know that by now. If we're not prepared for teams defending doggedly then we're in for a longer season than even I fear.

 

I didn't call them a pub team, but let's be clear they are a semi-pro side who finished fourth in the league of a country who are currently ranked 48th out of 55 European countries. Two of the countries below them are rocks in the sea, two are mountain tax havens and one is a war zone. They might beat the Dog and Duck first eleven on Glasgow Green on a Saturday morning but lets not pretend they are anything other than the poorest side Rangers have ever met in European football before now, because they are.

 

This is true - but it is also true that, historically, we have stood by our managers until we could no more. Some will say that we are already there with Pedro but I am, personally, definitely a fence-sitter in this regard. The result last week was absolutely catastrophic and there can be no excuses for it (not match fit, changes in personnel, UEFA timing of games are all just a cover for what was a terrible performance and horrendous result over two legs).

 

However, I do believe we need to see how his new recruits fit in before getting rid - he has Alves, Dorrans, Pena, Herrera all to still come in - all of whom would form the spine of the team, the most important element IMHO. We need to see how they integrate, enhance and improve on what we currently have before deciding to get rid of him. Last week's result deserved the criticism it received for both players and manager. But this is a marathon, not a sprint. Yes, he has had time with the squad but we all pretty much agree that what he inherited wasn't very good. His additions, for the most part, look pretty impressive - just sadly we haven't seen them yet.

 

The jury is very much out for me on Pedro - I just don't see any real organization or tactical genius in him. He talks about the transitions and phases of play - but then so can I, but you don't really want me as manager of Rangers.... but I have yet to see him really, really have an impact as a tactician on games. His record has been mediocre with us, but he had to use the hand he was dealt from Warburton. Now he has his own players in he should, and will, be judged on his own squad - but given we haven't seen almost half of the players he has brought in, and one could contend that the half we haven't seen are the most important half, I think he should be given some time to see how the perform together.

 

This was a howler of a result for us, no doubt about it. But European success was never going to happen anyway and we likely would have been put out by Limassol. I am not excusing it in any way, shape or form - but I do think we need to see how he and his players do before getting rid.

 

You may say that getting rid of him at Christmas is too late as the season would be ruined - you may very well be proven right. However, if we were to replace him right now his successor could very well have a ruinous season too given he would have no option but to utilize the players that Pedro would have left him. The choice isn't as easy as it sounds either because if we get rid of Pedro what would the reaction of the players that have just signed for him be ?

 

For sure, the players and management made a very large rod for their own backs last week - and they have a month almost before the next competitive game so they cant even atone quickly. They ALL should be ashamed of themselves.

[JohnMc 2,754]

I've been thinking of who the worst side we've ever been drawn against in Europe is. I think it's Progres but I could accept Gota from the Faroes might have been worse. They were Faroe champions at the time though so they might be expected to beat the 4th best side in Luxembourg.

Valletta of Malta are pretty poor too. Again they were Champions when we last met them but not when we met them in the 80s. To be fair we did score a barrel load against them that time. Anyone I've missed?

Edited July 11, 2017 by JohnMc