RST Write to Senior SNP Figures Over IRA Pub Visit

[Bluedell 5,679]

I think that is an exaggerated claim. So far I have not been aware of the police filming me at any game at Ibrox, they seem only interested in our self styled ultras.

 

There certainly does seem to be intimidation of anyone holding up Anti-SNP banners.

[jhunter 0]

I don't know about you but I enjoy listening to the Rangers' support when it rotates through the whole songbook. I feel energized when Ibrox is rocking. I especially miss TBB, but that's just an opinion.

The upshot is though, that we can't just go to the match on a Saturday and enjoy the game. We are forced, by the actions of others, to consider a more political environment. I don't have a police record, have never committed a felony, and yet if I want to watch the Rangers I am forced to watch the police filming me as I watch the game. Why? This is not football, this is politics. I never asked to be involved in politics while I watch my football team.

 

I think that is an exaggerated claim. So far I have not been aware of the police filming me at any game at Ibrox, they seem only interested in our self styled ultras.

 

they were filming fans coming off a train in Dunfermline? i think it was asking people to state their name into the camera

 

until someone pointed out to the assembled throng they had no legal obligation to do so.

[BEARGER 1,830]

There certainly does seem to be intimidation of anyone holding up Anti-SNP banners.

 

they were filming fans coming off a train in Dunfermline? i think it was asking people to state their name into the camera

 

until someone pointed out to the assembled throng they had no legal obligation to do so.

 

Neither of these posts contradicts what I said.

[RANGERRAB 3,732]

they were filming fans coming off a train in Dunfermline? i think it was asking people to state their name into the camera

 

until someone pointed out to the assembled throng they had no legal obligation to do so.

 

When was this? Absolutely scandalous if true.

Scotland becoming a police state under the SNP 'government' IMO.

[JohnMc 2,801]

As Pete says a well written post but as a former Hutchesonian I would question the above paragraph on two grounds.

 

Firstly there were two brothers Hutcheson; so it should be Hutchesons' not Hutcheson's.

 

Secondly, I don't see the connection between a 'rugby' School and choice of football team to support.

 

Hah, yeah feel free to correct my spelling and grammar, my comprehensive education was often lacking! :-)

 

My point on his choice of club to support was because I doubt he's following his grandfather and father's side or it through peer pressure at school, which is usually the case for most of us. He's chosen Celtic for 'other' reasons.

[limeburner 0]

Grammar police out in force today!!!

[calscot 0]

My point on his choice of club to support was because I doubt he's following his grandfather and father's side or it through peer pressure at school, which is usually the case for most of us.

 

Speak for yourself, some of us actually chose to support Rangers...

[JohnMc 2,801]

I reject the premise of your post on several points.

First, I am not a member of the RST.

You have stated and I agree that the Rangers' support is drawn from a broad church. The one thing that is common among the Rangers' fans is that we all support our team, and in our own way. Hence, I don't think it is appropriate for you to attempt to denigrate or attempt to belittle a supporter, or group, for their actions unless they are breaking the law.

 

Eh? Denigrate and belittle? When did I do that?

 

I think it is rather presumptious of you to imply that neither the RST, the Rangers' support nor the denizens of the Old Govan Arms are unaware of their history.

 

I don't, most people in this part of the world have very little understanding of Irish history. There are exceptions but not many. People who sing rebel songs in pubs of a Saturday tend to be pretty ignorant in my experience.

 

What exactly is this history and why does it impact on the OP? A few quotes ...

 

From a Southern Irish person's point of view ...

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/letters/commemorating-the-1916-rising-1.2114387

... Second, the utter lack of popular support for the Easter Rising at the time of its outbreak makes the “seminal moment” in the birth of our republic somewhat different from that of the American and French republics.

 

From Dr David Hume MBE, director of services, Grand Orange Lodge of Ireland ...

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/easter-1916-rebels-did-not-care-for-mandates-or-shirk-from-violence-1-7038811

... THE Easter Proclamation of 1916 was signed by seven men.

... But they could hardly have been said to represent the majority of nationalists or Roman Catholics in Ireland. In fact the seven men who led this revolutionary attempt were a small group within a small group, the Irish Republican Brotherhood.

... “Can dead people tell you what to do? Which ones? Didn’t Daniel O’Connell say that a single drop of blood was too much to pay for liberty?” Dudley Edwards asks.

 

Three groups, each with their own motives, participated in the Easter Rising.

 

The Irish Republican Brotherhood (IRB) was a secret revolutionary fraternity founded in the mid-19th century. They were also known as the '******s', and this group planned the rebellion.

The second key group involved in the rising was the anti-war Irish Volunteers who had split from Redmond's Volunteers in 1914.

They were led by Eoin MacNeill, a history professor who opposed the idea of an unprovoked rebellion, but the IRB secretly exercised considerable influence within the militia, controlling many of its leaders and officers.

The third group to participate in the rebellion was the Irish Citizen Army, a small socialist paramilitary organisation led by James Connolly.

 

The decision to rise was also based on the traditional ****** dictum that England's difficulty was Ireland's opportunity.

******s had long believed that only in time of war, with England distracted and the availability of a powerful European ally (Germany), could they hope to mount a successful challenge to the superior might of the British empire.

 

The aftermath

Most Irish people were appalled by the death and destruction unleashed by the rebellion.

The defeated rebels were jeered and attacked by some onlookers as they were led through the streets of Dublin.

But, as had occurred after earlier unsuccessful rebellions, Britain's response - including the execution of 15 of the leaders, the arrest of 3,430 men and 79 women (many of them entirely innocent) and the imposition of martial law throughout the entire country - provoked indignation and sympathy for the rebels.

The sacrifice of the rebels converted previously unsympathetic nationalists to the republican cause.

In the general election of December 1918, nationalist Ireland decisively rejected the Irish Party in favour of the new Sinn Fein party which identified itself with the 1916 rebels.

 

Now we have the connection between Sinn Fein and the residue of the violent gang that would become the IRA.

Why do we care?

******s would gravitate to the West of Scotland and mostly the streets of Glasgow. Here they would be confronted by Billy Fullarton's gang - The Billy Boys.

People being people, would take sides. They would also support the team of their culture. Hence Rangers and Celtic, although they are football clubs, are supported for the most part not only as football clubs but also because they are counter cultures.

Now in all honesty, do you think that the denizens of the Old Govan Arms, and their opposite numbers in numerous pubs of the opposite persuasion, do not know what they are singing and why they are singing it? I don't buy that point of view.

You may, or then again may not, agree that the arguments presented by Prof. Tom Devine and supported by our opposite culture were directly responsible for having The Billy Boys song banned because of the word '******'. The SNP government has made sure by the introduction of the OBA that this word shall remain forever objectionable.

These actions were not football related, but were strictly political.

 

I'm not sure if you're lionising the Billy Boys here Barca or comparing them to the IRA, or both.

Also, I don't have an "opposite culture" whatever the fuck that is, Martian perhaps? I'm culturally, linguistically, socially and ethnically identical to the Irish and those or Irish origin. So are you.

 

I don't know about you but I enjoy listening to the Rangers' support when it rotates through the whole songbook. I feel energized when Ibrox is rocking. I especially miss TBB, but that's just an opinion.

The upshot is though, that we can't just go to the match on a Saturday and enjoy the game. We are forced, by the actions of others, to consider a more political environment. I don't have a police record, have never committed a felony, and yet if I want to watch the Rangers I am forced to watch the police filming me as I watch the game. Why? This is not football, this is politics. I never asked to be involved in politics while I watch my football team.

Naivety just won't cut it here. We have to consider the political pressure exerted on us while being a Rangers' supporter. We also have to consider that Celtic and their supporters are entirely aware of the political pressure brought to bear on our club and support. With the outright bias of the media in many areas any slip is hugely exaggerated.

I'm sure that the advisors in Humza Yousaf's campaign are targeting the 'Irish' element of the Labour vote when they staged this event. However, I view this event as a huge mistake. I think he has taken the 'non-Irish' vote for granted and that this will come back to bite not only him but the SNP in other districts.

He can't stage an event in The Louden now, for example, who would believe him?

Finally, you'll remember how the Rangers' support has been devastated in the last five years? Many times they have looked for leadership from somewhere because of the travesties that have taken place in the boardroom. In my view, and remember I am not a member of the RST, I think the RST are to be congratulated for their stance in challenging this obvious political bias by the party who gave us the OBA.

 

You're conflating an awful lot of things Barca. It was a photo-op in a pub, it had nothing t do with Rangers. Dress that up anyway you want, it doesn't change it though.

Edited February 28, 2016 by JohnMc

[JohnMc 2,801]

Speak for yourself, some of us actually chose to support Rangers...

 

"Most" Calscot, most. No all.

[RANGERRAB 3,732]

I think it was more than just a photo in a pub.