Mohsni - The SFA have made an example out of me

[aweebluesoandso 290]

A pushb in the back is NOT violent conduct and my opinion of Mohsni has nothing to do with it.

 

Think about how many times players push others in the back in a football match; how many would be left at the end of they were all guilty of violent conduct? Yes the match was finished but Mohsni refused to shake hands, that's what started it. Erwin was wrong to push him, of course he was, but please look at the video again and tell me if you really and truly think that was violent conduct. Have you not seen one player push another out of the way to get the ball at a throw in, for example; how many such incidents are punished by a yellow never mind a red card?

 

Be it a strenuous, vigorous or violent push, that push started the whole indecent, not whether Moshni wanted to shake hands or not. Erwin's guilt being downplayed and him virtually being made the victim, does the truth no favours imo. Leave the rewriting of history to the master of deflection and spin BH.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

BH, I would give your viewpoint a whole lot more respect if you weren't so obviously clouded by your utter contempt for Mohsni.

 

You have shown it time and time again and this incident was like a red rag to a bull for you - it was easy pickings for you to put the boot into a player you hated. At the same time you actually defend the opponent when it is tough to defend him.

 

It really looks to me as if this was a gift horse for you to put the boot into Mohsni and absolve anyone else from the opposition of any blame.

 

Had Erwin not pushed him in the back then none of it would have happened. But all you can see is Mohsni's retaliation. And before anyone says "Mohsni started it by refusing to shake his hand" - Mohsni was not obligated to do so. Bad sportsman ? Sure. Bad loser ? Sure. Obligated ? No way. So the reaction of Erwin should be looked at as he clearly INSTIGATED the melee, despite having seen his team just stave off relegation, on the winning side, scored goals in the play offs.......

 

And we say that Mohsni is a nutcase ? I would say there is just as much justification to say Erwin is a nutcase !

 

I do indeed hold Mohsni in utter contempt but do not agree with your other comments or your reasoning. Of course you are correct that Mohsni was not OBLIGATED to shake hands; but Rangers players should be dignified in defeat IMHO and I know from earlier exchanges on this topic that not all agree with that either, so I'll leave it at that.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

Be it a strenuous, vigorous or violent push, that push started the whole indecent, not whether Moshni wanted to shake hands or not. Erwin's guilt being downplayed and him virtually being made the victim, does the truth no favours imo. Leave the rewriting of history to the master of deflection and spin BH.

 

Mucho gracias, estimado senor.

[westway 0]

Without a doubt the guy has being stitched up, first the media single him and only him out as the instigator who caused the whole thing, then the not fit for purpose compliance officer goes to work to inflict as much damage on a Rangers player and the least on the opposition.

How any sensible person can decide one man retaliating to severe provocation, however aggressively is seen as more serious than a group holding the same man down while others attack him is quite frankly mind boggling but there isn't anything sensible when it comes to the puppets at the SFA, particularly when it's Rangers related.

[craig 5,199]

A push in the back is NOT violent conduct and my opinion of Mohsni has nothing to do with it.

 

Think about how many times players push others in the back in a football match; how many would be left at the end of they were all guilty of violent conduct? Yes the match was finished but Mohsni refused to shake hands, that's what started it. Erwin was wrong to push him, of course he was, but please look at the video again and tell me if you really and truly think that was violent conduct. Have you not seen one player push another out of the way to get the ball at a throw in, for example; how many such incidents are punished by a yellow never mind a red card?

 

As I have told you before ad nauseum.... a push in the back DURING a game is a far, far cry from a push in the back POST game. A player expects it during a game, but certainly doesn't during the game. That, for me, negates anything else you say on this matter. The rest of your argument about push in the back at a throw in is absolute horseshit, IMHO... why ? Because players expect it during a game, but never do post game !!

 

As for the refusal to shake hands - can you point me to a rule book which stipulates he is obligated to do so ? I doubt it. Which, whether you like it or not, means Mohsni technically didn't start it. Guilty of poor sportsmanship ? Sure. Broke any rules ? Show me the rules.......

 

Yes, I truly think it is violent conduct under the rules of the game. Tell me why you don't think it is please. I have seen people sent off for far less than what Erwin did to Mohsni.

 

Your opinion of Mohsni has everything to do with it. You are biased.

[pete 2,499]

Pushing someone in the back who is not expecting it could actually be extremely dangerous and could easily cause injury such as a whiplash.

It was an act of aggression as it was in retaliation to Mohsni not shaking his hand. The SFA are totally wrong on this but they are regularly wrong on worse things.

[BrahimHemdani 1]

As I have told you before ad nauseum.... a push in the back DURING a game is a far, far cry from a push in the back POST game. A player expects it during a game, but certainly doesn't during the game. That, for me, negates anything else you say on this matter. The rest of your argument about push in the back at a throw in is absolute horseshit, IMHO... why ? Because players expect it during a game, but never do post game !!

 

As for the refusal to shake hands - can you point me to a rule book which stipulates he is obligated to do so ? I doubt it. Which, whether you like it or not, means Mohsni technically didn't start it. Guilty of poor sportsmanship ? Sure. Broke any rules ? Show me the rules.......

 

Yes, I truly think it is violent conduct under the rules of the game. Tell me why you don't think it is please. I have seen people sent off for far less than what Erwin did to Mohsni.

 

Your opinion of Mohsni has everything to do with it. You are biased.

 

I have already said that "Of course you are correct that Mohsni was not OBLIGATED to shake hands."

 

However, you are wrong about the rest and, since you ask, I will tell you why. Violent conduct is judged in the same way before (for example if a player were to punch or kick another player in the tunnel before the teams take the field), during, or after the match (as in this case, or indeed if it happened in the car park after the match); all of which falls under the jurisdiction of the referee. The fact that a push in the back after the final whistle, as you say in retaliation for a failure to act like a good sportsman and shake hands, may well be reprehensible, does not turn an act that is not violent like a push in the back, into violent conduct. It is "ungentlemanly conduct" in old money "unsporting behaviour" as it is now called and rightly punished by a caution and not classed as an ordering off offence.

 

This what constitutes viloent conduct:

 

• 
  
• A player is guilty of violent conduct if he uses excessive force or brutality against an opponent when not challenging for the ball.
  
• Violent conduct may occur either on the field of play or outside its boundaries, whether the ball is in play or not.
  
• He is also guilty of violent conduct if he uses excessive force or brutality against a team-mate, spectator, match official or any other person
  

 

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/afdeveloping/refereeing/7.%20law%2012_miscounduct_557.pdf

 

I doubt you will find many referees who would regard a push in the back (particularly where it was not sufficiently forceful to knock the player down) as use of excessive force. As I point out above, just because it took place after the final whistle and Mohsni was not expecting it, though you concede his action caused it, does not make it an act of excessive force i.e. violent conduct. If you look at the pictures and the notes in the guide to the rule you will see that:

 

A player is guilty of serious foul play if he uses excessive force or brutality against an opponent when challenging for the ball when it is in play; and indeed violent conduct may occur either on the field of play or outside its boundaries, whether the ball is in play or not.

 

“Using excessive force” means that the player has far exceeded the necessary use of force and is in danger injuring his opponent.

 

The pictures show what is meant by excessive force e.g. over the ball tackles, or where:

 

Any player who lunges at an opponent when challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force and endangering the safety of an opponent, is guilty of serious foul play; which is the same category of ordering off offence as violent conduct.

 

So taking that into the context of this incident, did Erwin's actions put Mohsni in danger of injury, I think not. Was it an act of "brutality", again I think not. Was it cowardly, perhaps so; does that make it "violent" as defined, I think not.

 

In any event there is no justification whatsoever for Mohsni's response, which without doubt was doubly violent and placed Erwin in danger of injury.

Edited June 21, 2015 by BrahimHemdani

[limeburner 0]

BH,the laws of the game are all subject to interpretation.

To do this properly,you need to be impartial.

IMPARTIAL.....even handed,fair,just,objective,open minded,unbiased,unprejudiced.

When the subject is Bilel mohsni,you sir are NONE of these things.

Taking this into consideration,I would suggest your opinions are worthless.

[pete 2,499]

I have already said that "Of course you are correct that Mohsni was not OBLIGATED to shake hands."

 

However, you are wrong about the rest and, since you ask, I will tell you why. Violent conduct is judged in the same way before (for example if a player were to punch or kick another player in the tunnel before the teams take the field, during, or after the match (as in this case, or indeed if it happened in the car park after the match); all of which falls under the jurisdiction of the referee. The fact that a push in the back after the final whistle, as you say in retaliation for a failure to act like a good sportsman and shake hands, may well be reprehensible, does not turn an act that is not violent like a push in the back, into violent conduct. It is "ungentlemanly conduct" in old money "unsporting behaviour" as it is now called and rightly punished by a caution and not classed as an ordering off offence.

 

This what constitutes viloent conduct:

 

• 
  
• A player is guilty of violent conduct if he uses excessive force or brutality against an opponent when not challenging for the ball.
  
• Violent conduct may occur either on the field of play or outside its boundaries, whether the ball is in play or not.
  
• He is also guilty of violent conduct if he uses excessive force or brutality against a team-mate, spectator, match official or any other person
  

 

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/afdeveloping/refereeing/7.%20law%2012_miscounduct_557.pdf

 

I doubt you will find many referees who would regard a push in the back (particularly where it was not sufficiently forceful to knock the player down) as use of excessive force. As I point out above, just because it took place after the final whistle and Mohsni was not expecting it, though you concede his action caused it, does not make it an act of excessive force i.e. violent conduct. If you look at the pictures and the notes in the guide to the rule you will see that:

 

A player is guilty of serious foul play if he uses excessive force or brutality against an opponent when challenging for the ball when it is in play; and indeed violent conduct may occur either on the field of play or outside its boundaries, whether the ball is in play or not.

 

“Using excessive force” means that the player has far exceeded the necessary use of force and is in danger injuring his opponent.

 

The pictures show what is meant by excessive force e.g. over the ball tackles, or where:

 

Any player who lunges at an opponent when challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force and endangering the safety of an opponent, is guilty of serious foul play; which is the same category of ordering off offence as violent conduct.

 

So taking that into the context of this incident, did Erwin's actions put Mohsni in danger of injury, I think not. Was it an act of "brutality", again I think not. Was it cowardly, perhaps so; does that make it "violent" as defined, I think not.

 

In any event there is no justification whatsoever for Mohsni's response, which without doubt was doubly violent and placed Erwin in danger of injury.

 

I totally disagree that an unexpected push in the back cannot cause injury. There is a danger of whiplash and at an extreme you could break your neck. You could also fall awkwardly opening up the possibility of a number of injuries.

[der Berliner 3,815]

...

In any event there is no justification whatsoever for Mohsni's response, which without doubt was doubly violent and placed Erwin in danger of injury.

 

Hardly anyone will disagree that Mohsni over-reacted. Yet, Erwin knew full well what the reaction would be. Just being mauled 6-1 on aggregate, home fans hurling abuse and jeering, and someone comes in from the back and pushes you like "hey look ye fanny, ye f*cked it up"! He was out to cause havoc much like the Well fans goading the Bears a few minutes later. It is beyond joke that Erwin has not been charged here, as he was the instigator of it all and, if anything, caused the turmoil that ensued.

 

While I am at it, has Motherwell been charged for the lack of stewarding and policing by now?

 

NB: I do believe that any other Rangers player would have shown a similar, if not as violant reaction like Mohsni.

Edited June 21, 2015 by der Berliner