craig 5,199 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 9% and cant own anymore. we also have not been informed of the loan arrangements. why? how is strengthening Rangers playing into Ashleys hand? it does the opposite. Every Rangers success and move forward is proof of his negative effect in running the club through his cohorts previously. He is being careful with his money and i have no problem with that. Unfortunately that is not what he is saying at nearly every press conference. He is playing into the medias hand who will turn the fact he can get his money back or more when it suits them. He constantly says he will cover the short fall from investing in the team and the infrastructure at a loss to himself. That is not the case. He is being more than cute with his words. He will get his investment back. Its a loan. would put money on the fact that that bit of paper becomes worth more than his outlay in the next 5-10 years Not to mention the fact i see a share issue as never happening or atleast not anytime soon. Think the new time frame mentioned today is 3-4 months away. How many dates is that now that have been penciled in? It seems the investment is getting smaller now they have control. With no transfer budget looking likely this window and no share issue until the jan window which he says today we will only outlay in if we need a push to win the championship. Is it fair to say in the next 12 months he will likely only invest another £3m give or take which will cover the running deficit? how much to you see him putting in in the next season? Taking your points in turn. 1. What is your point about Ashley's 9% owenership ? Doesn't matter that he cant own anymore. Any "investment" by T3B or King is, effectively, seeing 9% go to Ashley. Which would you rather - a 1.5 million investment that Ashley could potentially (no matter how unlikely, it still is potentially) get 9% of - or.... alternatively, provide a 1.5 million loan which could, once a shareholder approval is received, be converted into equity. That same share issue would also see Ashley's shareholding diluted (he can actually purchase up to 10% without the dual ownership issue coming into play). Makes absolutely no sense to donate the funds whilst Ashley is still causing trouble (as we know he is). By providing it as a loan it gives the Club much needed funds without having to go to a shareholder approval to do so. 2. Why would we be informed of the loan arrangements ? Does King or the Club have an obligation to provide those to you, me or even the shareholders ? I would consider those business transactions and not something which needs to be in the public domain. That said, I would be surprised if they don't actually give the details at the EGM this Friday. Either way, I personally don't see the issue - not everything needs to be public. Indeed, not everything should be public. I would be surprised if the loan funds were securitized. 3. Strengthening Rangers playing into Ashley's hands - not sure where you get that I suggested this. Where did I suggest it ? I merely said that whilst Ashley can cause trouble it doesn't make sense to donate those funds to the Club. Once they have the share issue which will undoubtedly dilute Ashley's shareholding he can then convert the shares into equity and/or, donate funds to the Club. If he has no intent on selling his shares then the money is, in essence, a donation anyway. But the added bonus is that Ashley's influence in terms of shareholding would be lowered. 4. But he isn't saying he CANT get his money back. He is saying he doesn't think he will get it back. Those are two very different statements. 5. How is it not the case that he will get his investment back ? Are you suggesting the 1.5 million he has loaned is the only money needed to invest in the team and infrastructure ? As I keep saying, it is likely that loan will be converted into equity which, yes, makes it an investment. How much of his 20 million INVESTMENT did he get back 10 years ago ? None. So to suggest he WILL get it back is to ignore what can happen with shareholdings. The piece of paper isn't worth shit if he doesn't sell his shares. And he has said nothing about selling his shares, has he ? You do understand the difference between an investment and a loan, right ? You say "he will get his investment back. It's a loan" - by definition, being a loan means it isn't an investment. Again, you miss the point entirely. He couldn't invest in a share issue (the only way to get money into the Club's hands other than a donation). A loan, at this point, was pretty much the only option. 6. A share issue WILL happen. I have little doubt over that. In fact, I am willing to wager with you that it will happen. Because a share issue is the only way that they will be able to dilute Ashley (and cohorts) shareholding from it's current level. Loans do nothing in terms of investment in the Club so they aren't a long term solution and, as I said, donations are dangerous. It doesn't really matter too much if the share issue happens today, tomorrow, 3 months or 6 months along the line. Timing is everything with share issues (though our share issue will likely see the current major players, Ashley aside, taking up the vast majority of any issue). But it WILL be needed because the Club WILL need investment for both infrastructure and footballing department. 7. Are you just surmising that there will be no transfer budget ? When did King say that ? They share issue they said 3-4 months - so unless you have the inside track on that it would point to being this side of the New Year - Not sure why we would bring players in January if we look like a shoe-in for the league anyway - better to save your powder for when we are in the SPFL I would have thought. Again, I am willing to wager that he will put in more than 3 million in the next 12 months. Fairly significantly more. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Celtic got two crackers for less than 2 million recently. There are loads. I see one we recently ignored is being quoted at 20 million. And that quote was nonsense. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 How does a share issue work without a listing on any exchange. You can still have private issues, I believe. I stand to be corrected though. He did say that they would be looking to re-list as part of the strategy on having a share issue though. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the gunslinger 3,366 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 And that quote was nonsense. It was designed to get ten and might well do so. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
raygun 0 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 You can still have private issues, I believe. I stand to be corrected though. He did say that they would be looking to re-list as part of the strategy on having a share issue though. He also said his personal preference was not to be listed, is there any historical evidence of non-listed companies presenting share issues, perhaps we should find that out first, although Friday may go a long way to resolving the listing issue. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueSolace 0 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 I hope people give this the board the time and space they need....I think people are being unrealistic....ffs it is only a week since we lost the play-offs ....appointments need time and as for finances we have run out of revenue streams and re-finamcing initiatives because of the previous boards incompetence/waste/financial mismanagement. Whoever is appointed manager needs to be backed 100% by the fans... promotion is a must. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig 5,199 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 He also said his personal preference was not to be listed, is there any historical evidence of non-listed companies presenting share issues, perhaps we should find that out first, although Friday may go a long way to resolving the listing issue. His personal preference may indeed be to not be listed - but he has a bunch of other shareholders who may disagree with his personal preference. Did he not say in his interview today that the Club would be looking to re-list and have a share issue in the coming months ? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian1964 10,724 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 I hope people give this the board the time and space they need....I think people are being unrealistic....ffs it is only a week since we lost the play-offs ....appointments need time and as for finances we have run out of revenue streams and re-finamcing initiatives because of the previous boards incompetence/waste/financial mismanagement. Whoever is appointed manager needs to be backed 100% by the fans... promotion is a must. We should buy the maximum season tickets we can for a start 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RANGERRAB 3,678 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 We should buy the maximum season tickets we can for a start Without knowing who the manager will be AND who we will be signing there is absolutely no chance of that happening. You might have total faith in KingCo others like myself want them to prove themselves first and today did hothing whatsoever in that respect unfortunately for me 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian1964 10,724 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Without knowing who the manager will be AND who we will be signing there is absolutely no chance of that happening.You might have total faith in KingCo others like myself want them to prove themselves first and today did hothing whatsoever in that respect unfortunately for me You,and others, can do as you please as I've already said. I can't remember Rangers fans waiting to see who the manager is before buying a season ticket?,or what players are signed as well?. Right now if Rangers fans don't buy season tickets then maybe you won't get the standard of players you want before buying a season ticket?. I believe we have in Kingco Rangers men in charge and that they will do their best for the club,aye!. Out of interest when did you last buy a season ticket? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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