Poor attendances suggest Celtic need Rangers

[compo 7,228]

the moronic fans wanted the rangers taken down they got what they wanted , now the buggers want us back well they can go and stuff it we will be back when were ready

[pete 2,499]

I actually used to support all Scottish teams in Europe including Celtic but those days are gone. Hate is a big word and really an emotion I don't want to have as it is a bigger punishment for yourself as the person who you hate. Celtic just mean nothing to me.

[barca72 440]

I hate to break up your warm and fuzzy feelings here guys, but I think you are a little bit out of order.

Crawford01 ( post #24 ),

You say you say that we "lorded" it over Scottish football and should meekly accept that we should be "humiliated and hamstrung" as our punishment. ... Not for a moment should the support accept that precept.

 

You say, "most of the Celtic fans I speak to don't want us dead" ... Was that the same fans who threatened their own board, and that of other clubs, with a boycott if they did not vote Rangers out of the SPL?

 

Then you say, "and I detect a certain softening in attitude among several of my acquaintences following the various commission verdicts which have (essentially) found in our favour over the past 2 years." ... What do you expect them to do, they were wrong ? What do we care what their attitude is? We did not cheat, don't forget that.

 

Then you say, "If they bait us, we can be confident enough in the facts to smile and not rise to it." ... Do you remember how the dignified silence worked for us under SDM? If these people write one word that is false they should be hounded down and exposed. If it is of a physical nature then the police should take care of it.

 

Hildy ( post #26 ),

You say, "This idea that they are so despicable now that we can't breathe the same air and compete against one another is a form of intolerance." ... Agreed. However, remember whose intolerance and bigotry caused us to be in the position we are in. I am sure you can forgive the support for not wishing to rush back to a similar atmosphere as existed in the SPL.

 

Then you say, "The perception that some of us have that our present situation is pure and wonderful is delusion off the scale. Watching paint dry ... " ... How dare you accuse the Rangers support of being deluded? They follow their club out of a sense of love and loyalty not delusion. Many a supporter has made it known that they find these last 18 months to be a more enjoyable experience than the SPL. They have stated that Ibrox has a more family-orientated atmosphere now and many of them are taking their children to games that they would never have contemplated in the past. They do not find the same level of hooliganism and intolerance spewing from the away fans' area as they did in the past in the SPL. This is a fact and not a delusion, and can only be good for the future of Rangers' supporter base. Perhaps you may find it strange that some people see a football match as something more than the adrenaline rush of beating Celtic.

 

In summary, you both seem to want the Rangers support to accept some form of guilt for what has happened. I refute that. When Whyte is finally indicted and found guilty of his crimes, we as a club and a support will be shown to be the victims and not the perpetrators of wrong deeds.

We are certainly entitled to let the world know that we are Scotland's most successful club and we are also entitled to make sure that we are never again treated so shabbily by Scottish football's corrupt ruling cabal.

This present "soft" approach by a few members of the MSM is nothing more than a smoke screen. Next they'll be telling us that Rangers should move on and embrace our friendly rivals from across the city. Are you ready to buy that crap?

[Hildy 0]

Barca, the spectacle of watching Rangers right now is ghastly. The football is junk and the competitive element is absent. There is an absence of excitement and an overdose of tedium.

 

Children are begging their parents to stop taking them to Ibrox so dull is the fare on offer, and many people, including children, prefer a hostile atmosphere at the game rather than the sound of texting and sweetie-paper rustling.

 

The delusion is not in being there - it is in pretending that the experience is something that it clearly isn't. A bunch of my mates quite readily admit that they only go because of the social side. This is the matchday highlight. They keep in regular touch because of the football and are reluctant to give it up even though they no longer enjoy it - and their kids are now showing more interest in the EPL and Spanish big two than Rangers.

 

As for events of the last two years, I note that you want to apportion blame everywhere except at your own door. We may indeed have been subjected to criminality inside Ibrox, and if we have, I hope the guilty are identified and prosecuted, but what about the other side of the coin?

 

When things were going well under David Murray, did you claim the credit for us dominating domestically, or did you give 100% of the plaudits to him? Can we refuse to take responsibility when owners are dubious, but proclaim how great we are when we have a custodian who is good?

 

This idea that the support is never responsible for any of the ills that befall the club is akin to the victim culture that is so embedded across the city. 'It wisnae us - a big boy did it and ran away'.

 

Let's not duck the issues. We witnessed a catastrophe at Ibrox. Some of us are big enough to accept that responsibility. As a support we failed dismally to stop the rot. On our watch, Rangers collapsed and nearly expired.

 

I'm not going to walk away from that. If Rangers was burgled, we held the door open for the burglars - and there is still no sign of it being slammed shut.

[RANGERRAB 3,770]

Hildy - regards your comment about criminality, what if It is proven SDM was forced to sell to Whyte by LBG ? Remember who was in charge of LBG's Scottish business division after LBG took over HBOS.

I am of the opinion that Rangers FC were the victims of a very serious stitch-up with the aim of putting us out of business altogether.It was orchestrated by our enemies in senior positions in governmental and banking positions.

My dearest wish is that all will be revealed in 2014.

[pete 2,499]

Hildy - regards your comment about criminality, what if It is proven SDM was forced to sell to Whyte by LBG ? Remember who was in charge of LBG's Scottish business division after LBG took over HBOS.

I am of the opinion that Rangers FC were the victims of a very serious stitch-up with the aim of putting us out of business altogether.It was orchestrated by our enemies in senior positions in governmental and banking positions.

My dearest wish is that all will be revealed in 2014.

 

I feel for you mate but don't hold your breath.

[barca72 440]

Barca, the spectacle of watching Rangers right now is ghastly. The football is junk and the competitive element is absent. There is an absence of excitement and an overdose of tedium.

 

Children are begging their parents to stop taking them to Ibrox so dull is the fare on offer, and many people, including children, prefer a hostile atmosphere at the game rather than the sound of texting and sweetie-paper rustling.

 

The delusion is not in being there - it is in pretending that the experience is something that it clearly isn't. A bunch of my mates quite readily admit that they only go because of the social side. This is the matchday highlight. They keep in regular touch because of the football and are reluctant to give it up even though they no longer enjoy it - and their kids are now showing more interest in the EPL and Spanish big two than Rangers.

 

As for events of the last two years, I note that you want to apportion blame everywhere except at your own door. We may indeed have been subjected to criminality inside Ibrox, and if we have, I hope the guilty are identified and prosecuted, but what about the other side of the coin?

 

When things were going well under David Murray, did you claim the credit for us dominating domestically, or did you give 100% of the plaudits to him? Can we refuse to take responsibility when owners are dubious, but proclaim how great we are when we have a custodian who is good?

 

This idea that the support is never responsible for any of the ills that befall the club is akin to the victim culture that is so embedded across the city. 'It wisnae us - a big boy did it and ran away'.

 

Let's not duck the issues. We witnessed a catastrophe at Ibrox. Some of us are big enough to accept that responsibility. As a support we failed dismally to stop the rot. On our watch, Rangers collapsed and nearly expired.

 

I'm not going to walk away from that. If Rangers was burgled, we held the door open for the burglars - and there is still no sign of it being slammed shut.

 

We witnessed a catastrophe alright but what could the support , under the setup of SDM, possibly have done about it? Maybe Rangerrab is closer to the truth.

[Hildy 0]

RangerRab, if there has been any criminality, I want to know about it. If there has been some kind of conspiracy to destroy the club, I want the story out in the open. If there has been sinister involvement by people influential at Celtic - past or present - I want them named.

 

We can not, however, keep portraying ourselves as victims when the door of Ibrox is permanently wedged open to whoever wants to own it.

 

What we are doing here is complaining about burglary and vandalism after leaving the front and back door open. Even if there has been criminality, we should at least admit that our own failure to properly take care of a club we care dearly for has been a contributory factor in this sorry tale.

[Mountain Bear 0]

I hate to break up your warm and fuzzy feelings here guys, but I think you are a little bit out of order.

Crawford01 ( post #24 ),

You say you say that we "lorded" it over Scottish football and should meekly accept that we should be "humiliated and hamstrung" as our punishment. ... Not for a moment should the support accept that precept.

 

You say, "most of the Celtic fans I speak to don't want us dead" ... Was that the same fans who threatened their own board, and that of other clubs, with a boycott if they did not vote Rangers out of the SPL?

 

Then you say, "and I detect a certain softening in attitude among several of my acquaintences following the various commission verdicts which have (essentially) found in our favour over the past 2 years." ... What do you expect them to do, they were wrong ? What do we care what their attitude is? We did not cheat, don't forget that.

 

Then you say, "If they bait us, we can be confident enough in the facts to smile and not rise to it." ... Do you remember how the dignified silence worked for us under SDM? If these people write one word that is false they should be hounded down and exposed. If it is of a physical nature then the police should take care of it.

 

Hildy ( post #26 ),

You say, "This idea that they are so despicable now that we can't breathe the same air and compete against one another is a form of intolerance." ... Agreed. However, remember whose intolerance and bigotry caused us to be in the position we are in. I am sure you can forgive the support for not wishing to rush back to a similar atmosphere as existed in the SPL.

 

Then you say, "The perception that some of us have that our present situation is pure and wonderful is delusion off the scale. Watching paint dry ... " ... How dare you accuse the Rangers support of being deluded? They follow their club out of a sense of love and loyalty not delusion. Many a supporter has made it known that they find these last 18 months to be a more enjoyable experience than the SPL. They have stated that Ibrox has a more family-orientated atmosphere now and many of them are taking their children to games that they would never have contemplated in the past. They do not find the same level of hooliganism and intolerance spewing from the away fans' area as they did in the past in the SPL. This is a fact and not a delusion, and can only be good for the future of Rangers' supporter base. Perhaps you may find it strange that some people see a football match as something more than the adrenaline rush of beating Celtic.

 

In summary, you both seem to want the Rangers support to accept some form of guilt for what has happened. I refute that. When Whyte is finally indicted and found guilty of his crimes, we as a club and a support will be shown to be the victims and not the perpetrators of wrong deeds.

We are certainly entitled to let the world know that we are Scotland's most successful club and we are also entitled to make sure that we are never again treated so shabbily by Scottish football's corrupt ruling cabal.

This present "soft" approach by a few members of the MSM is nothing more than a smoke screen. Next they'll be telling us that Rangers should move on and embrace our friendly rivals from across the city. Are you ready to buy that crap?

 

Sorry, but I didn't suggest we should accept being humiliated or hamstrung, or that we should feel guilty for anything.

 

We used to win everything in sight and weren't slow in letting everyone else know about it. I just don't think we should have been surprised when they (and I was referring to non Celtic fans) then took more pleasure from our problems than they would have done from another team's.

 

As for Celtic fans, my point was that the views of the internet warriors don't reflect what I hear ordinary fans saying. That doesn't mean that I don't get irritated by the crap I read on social media, just that I don't think it's that representative of the majority. That leaves me comfortable with the idea of playing and competing with them again in future.

[barca72 440]

Sorry, but I didn't suggest we should accept being humiliated or hamstrung, or that we should feel guilty for anything.

 

We used to win everything in sight and weren't slow in letting everyone else know about it. I just don't think we should have been surprised when they (and I was referring to non Celtic fans) then took more pleasure from our problems than they would have done from another team's.

 

As for Celtic fans, my point was that the views of the internet warriors don't reflect what I hear ordinary fans saying. That doesn't mean that I don't get irritated by the crap I read on social media, just that I don't think it's that representative of the majority. That leaves me comfortable with the idea of playing and competing with them again in future.

 

You're entitled to your opinion, so let's agree to disagree on meeting them.