der Berliner 3,808 Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Just out of interest ... a question I always wanted to ask the Whyte-critics ... where does he got the 18odd million from to buy Rangers out of their Lloyds debts? I mean, someone cannot just whip-up a company and take on someone elses debt on the basis of "nothing". Lloyds sure received their money, didn't they? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 2,499 Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Just out of interest ... a question I always wanted to ask the Whyte-critics ... where does he got the 18odd million from to buy Rangers out of their Lloyds debts? I mean, someone cannot just whip-up a company and take on someone elses debt on the basis of "nothing". Lloyds sure received their money, didn't they? I am sure it is thought he borrowed it from an offshore lender. Not fact just what I thought I read. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrahimHemdani 1 Posted December 29, 2011 Author Share Posted December 29, 2011 Just out of interest ... a question I always wanted to ask the Whyte-critics ... where does he got the 18odd million from to buy Rangers out of their Lloyds debts? I mean, someone cannot just whip-up a company and take on someone elses debt on the basis of "nothing". Lloyds sure received their money, didn't they? Three possible explanations that I can see: The company owns some property from previous deals and has used it as collateral to borrow the money and if their bankers are truly LBG then no money need have changed hands, just the debt moved from Rangers to Whyte's company (which would assume that LBG like him more than they like Rangers or (perhaps football clubs in general)). He has backers who are not listed as directors (it was strongly rumoured that Ellis' backers were Saudis, so perhaps that's why he is on board) He has some money of his own from previous deals. Or some combination of the above. No hard evidence just speculation on my part but as previously stated I was in contact with Ellis' representative in Guernsey during the time of his bid. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
khan 0 Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Just out of interest ... a question I always wanted to ask the Whyte-critics ... where does he got the 18odd million from to buy Rangers out of their Lloyds debts? I mean, someone cannot just whip-up a company and take on someone elses debt on the basis of "nothing". Lloyds sure received their money, didn't they? I am reasonably certain that it is a circular and very cynical arrangement for the debt, it hasn't gone anywhere we as a club owe it to our new owner who will almost certainly owe it to LBG, they can dress it up any way they like leverage is leverage and our assets are one very big lever. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
der Berliner 3,808 Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 I am reasonably certain that it is a circular and very cynical arrangement for the debt, it hasn't gone anywhere we as a club owe it to our new owner who will almost certainly owe it to LBG, they can dress it up any way they like leverage is leverage and our assets are one very big lever. Why would LBG do that? They gain nothing from Whyte or this new Rangers Football Group thing, especially if Whyte does indeed waive the debt ... as he has promised to the world? Well, you may claim this is a bluff for he knew all along that we/he will lose the HMRC case, but ain't there a lot of negative thinking and assumptions involved here? 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrahimHemdani 1 Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 I am reasonably certain that it is a circular and very cynical arrangement for the debt, it hasn't gone anywhere we as a club owe it to our new owner who will almost certainly owe it to LBG, they can dress it up any way they like leverage is leverage and our assets are one very big lever. This what I have said along, we are not "debt free" we just owe the money to Whyte's company (who probably owe it to LBG) rather than directly to the bank. A circular deal as you say. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrahimHemdani 1 Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Why would LBG do that? They gain nothing from Whyte or this new Rangers Football Group thing, especially if Whyte does indeed waive the debt ... as he has promised to the world? Well, you may claim this is a bluff for he knew all along that we/he will lose the HMRC case, but ain't there a lot of negative thinking and assumptions involved here? Yes there are, but he's a businessman used to taking risks; he's in a no lose situation because I don't believe it's all or mostly his money and even if it is and we win the case he gets the Club for £18M and makes his money developing the land in the SW corner. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
khan 0 Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 (edited) Why would LBG do that? They gain nothing from Whyte or this new Rangers Football Group thing, especially if Whyte does indeed waive the debt ... as he has promised to the world? Well, you may claim this is a bluff for he knew all along that we/he will lose the HMRC case, but ain't there a lot of negative thinking and assumptions involved here? You would have to understand the nefarious intracacies of evasion and avoidance which I am sure you do, thickness of a cell wall and other adages, just let us say a bank which has had money by the billion from taxpayers is and has made sure that they will get theirs as they see it before anyone else revenue included. Murray must be laughing up his sleeve unless of course the £1 for a piece of paper which appears to have been written by Steven Spielberg and get a club free, gets exposed for what it is, fiction. Just to be clear about the accounts that may or may not have been signed of for the term end to 30 June 2011, they are more or less the previous regimes accounts. Edited December 30, 2011 by khan 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
forlanssister 3,114 Posted December 30, 2011 Share Posted December 30, 2011 Just out of interest ... a question I always wanted to ask the Whyte-critics ... where does he got the 18odd million from to buy Rangers out of their Lloyds debts? I mean, someone cannot just whip-up a company and take on someone elses debt on the basis of "nothing". Lloyds sure received their money, didn't they? Liberty Capital our ultimate owner is based in the BVI as are six subsidiaries of LBG. LBG are bankers to some of if not all Whytes other companies, LBG hold the mortgage on Whytes (and Mrs Whytes) castle. Whyte has a long association with LBG, as far as I'm aware we still bank with LBG and LBG are the holders of the long lease on the Albion car park. Neither LBG nor Murray could be seen to publicly pull the plug on RFC and have found someone who simply wouldn't give a flying f*&k about doing so, LBG wins Murray wins Whyte wins the only losers are the fans, 26,000 small shareholders, a few thousand debenture holders, HMRC and a myriad of creditors. 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrahimHemdani 1 Posted December 30, 2011 Author Share Posted December 30, 2011 Liberty Capital our ultimate owner is based in the BVI as are six subsidiaries of LBG. LBG are bankers to some of if not all Whytes other companies, LBG hold the mortgage on Whytes (and Mrs Whytes) castle. Whyte has a long association with LBG, as far as I'm aware we still bank with LBG and LBG are the holders of the long lease on the Albion car park. Neither LBG nor Murray could be seen to publicly pull the plug on RFC and have found someone who simply wouldn't give a flying f*&k about doing so, LBG wins Murray wins Whyte wins the only losers are the fans, 26,000 small shareholders, a few thousand debenture holders, HMRC and a myriad of creditors. That's the best explanation I've heard yet, would explain a lot of the secrecy surrounding Whyte's finances that Johnston & Co found so troubling. I can do some more digging, I have "a source close to LBG". 0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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