Former Employees

[Guest Guivarc'h]

Boyd going stops at the door of Smith, end of.

 

If playing in Europe meant so much to him then pray why did he join Middlesbrough? Silly illogical argument designed solely at blaming a manager you don't like

[Guest Northampton_loyalist]

I am enjoying the debate NL. Loving it in fact. So let me get things right first - I didnt say you were acting like a Tim, if it came across that way then apologies. The vitriol that SA posted from FF is what is more "Tim-like" in my opinion, not what you are saying. As I said, I havent seen what was posted on there so cant comment but more than likely that debate also has others who are defending Boyd so it probably isnt all one-sided - would be very surprised if it was to be honest.

 

I respectfully suggest you go back and re-read your earlier posts water under the bridge, no harm no foul. I like nothing more than a debate. There ws no debate just simple minded stupidity. That has changed and long may it continue. The debate on FF is, as said, about even between the three factions; Hate, dont care and support.

 

Surely by suggesting he should have been looking out for the club is similar to saying he was duty bound ? If not then the debae kind of ends there does it not because if you dont think he was duty bound to look out for the club then he simply doesnt have to look out for the club, which he didnt and then we can all agree that he was at liberty to do as he chooses - which he did, and signed for Middlesborough. Simples.

 

Again, he is perfectly at liberty to do as he wishes. He is a fan though and the fact he overlooked his club for 100% selfish reasons is something that can and deserves to draw criticism. An actual fan would try and at least consider the club he supports. lets not forget that Boyd made an industry of telling us how proud he was and how much he loved us. Clearly not enough to let us factor in his financial situation. Again again, if he had no options or was not offered a deal then fair enough but he could have stayed and he could have earned plenty at a prem club. HE chose to ignore the club he told us so many times he loves in order to manouver himself slightly more cash. that is fine as far as it goes. In my book, however, it makes him an arse.

 

You are right though in that I have absolutely no problem with the actions Boyd took. None whatsoever and here is why.... If the club really wanted him to stay they should not have been waiting till the final 6 months of his tenure before offering him a deal. That much is simple. Players you want to retain should never be left until that point in their tenure before being offered - the club should have been offering an extension long before. They didnt, so why no abuse towards those who offer contracts at Rangers. Further, the club tried to punt him - so why should he think about them ? It is a BUSINESS, we all know that. Also, why should he move to Birmingham ? Maybe he didnt fancy it and preferred to stay closer to home. Lets not forget, after all, that he was allegedly offered TWICE as much money to go to Turkey - so maybe it wasn't all about money after all, just a thought.

 

The club is gubbed financially and made him an offer that was way above any deals we will be handing out. Infact, I think he would have been on more than anyone else at the club with the exception of perhaps Davis. that, whichever way you look at it and despite Wabbash's thoughts, shows a club that is doing everything it can to keep a player. Add to that the fact we are working day to day financially and there is VERY high chance that we had no option but to wait for Lloyds agreeing a budget beofre offering a deal.

 

Hey, MY club are floundering in financial turmoil too. NL, we ALL want what is best for Rangers and I, for one, would have wished Boyd had signed a new contract, stayed for a season and then left for a fee. But it didnt happen and you cannot argue that Boyd is not the person that put us in that position. Sure, he could have helped a bit by leaving last January.... but would we have won the league and the CL money that went with it ? Would we have won the league this season and the CL money that goes with it ? We will never know, but Boyd POTENTIALLY actually made us more money than he cost us by staying at Rangers for a further 18 months. None of us know but it is something we have to at least consider.

 

Boyd not putting us here is not a valid reason for him factoring out the club he loves in any decisions he makes. Well, it is, but only if his love is not really so great as he continually told us. He could have, as you say, signed the deal and stayed a year then moved. Everyone is a winner. BUT, Boyd would not be guaranteed the same cash in a year. So, Boyd does what is best for Boyd. that is entirely my issue. 'I love you, but not enough to do anything that might benefit us both, just incase'. Lets not forget that if he had stayed and no move materialized, he would STILL be on a bumper wage in a club that plays for honours season on season and plays in Europe. He jumped to a club that is not even guaranteed promotion to the league that might get him into europe. he is, in effect, using boro as a stepping stone if it is all about ambition. Why could he not have moved to brum? that would have been far more abitious unless his desires run no higher than a playoff struggle followed by a relegation fight.

 

Make no mistake, this was about money and only money.

I also dont understand why Boyd should go to Brum just because they play in a better league. If he wants to move for financial reasons that is his choosing and who are we to criticise. Even in our own walks of life PLENTY of people will move jobs primarily for monetary reasons, so why shouldnt he ? I dont think he chose the right club and he lacked ambition with that signing - but it is his choice to make and if he wants money to be his tin god then so be it.

 

Make your mind up. One minute it is not about the money, the next it is. If it is about the cash he went to boro for the money. he also ran down his contract to get it. if it is about the football he has no ambitions higher than promotion and a fight to survive in the prem. If he is using Boro as a stepping stone then why not sit with us a year and move to get us and him some benefit.

 

It was 100% about Boyd.

 

I am not convinced that your "26k a week" statement isnt flawed. with 4k a game played he want going to be playing every game - so whilst it could have been 26k a week IF he played in both a Sat and Wed game it also could have been "only" 18k a week if he was selected for neither game. What is he on at Boro ? 27k ? That is 9k a week more GUARANTEED (assuming his 27k a week is not based on appearances). So, sure, it COULD have been 26k a week but hardly guaranteed.

 

So, it was all about the money again? Kris Boyd would have played in every game he was fit for this season I think. We have little in the way of adequate cover and no left wing. His main competition for the strikers role alongside Miller would have been Lafferty, who will as things stand spend a season on the left again. The only games he would have missed would be in Europe with one up front. He would have played all SPL games bar maybe the OF games, giving him �£4k per week and �£8k a good few weeks. that is before you look at the cups. He would have made less but not a whole lot less.

Also, were Birmingham back in for him this summer ? I dont know, genuine question. But comparing Brum with Boro is only relevant it both were in for him this summer. Last Jan he could have moved to Brum - but maybe he thought if he played well enough he could get an even better club to sign for. Then he finds out this summer that he misjudged what would be on offer to him. Not saying that IS the case but it could be. And to compare the offer from Brum in Jan 2009 to the offer from Boro in July 2010 is only relevant if both were still in for him. Were they ? How was he to know that by turning down Brum last year that there wouldnt be the same interest from EPL clubs this year ?

yes they were http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/r/rangers/8601783.stm

 

Maybe it is me but I feel that "Boyd can kiss my arse" is effectively the same as saying "Boyd can go fuck himself" - is it really not the same thing and is this not arguing semantics ?

 

There are clear and varying degrees of distaste. 'kiss my arse' is mild, 'fuck yourself' harsher and 'i hope you die' right up there. Clearly I dislike what he did but I dont particularly hate him for it, I just think he acted like an arsehole.

 

Re the "acting like a Tim" - I said it is behaviour I would expect from a Tim - and it is, I wont say otherwise because, rightly or wrongly, I DO expect better from Bears. Let me state, I dont mean what YOU are saying NL, but some of those comments that SA posted, which came from FF.

 

As for the FF thing - as I said, I agree, it isnt FF that is posting those things, it is members from FF and being the largest fans forum the whole spectrum of attitude will no doubt be covered !

 

As Gav says, we really shouldnt care that much about Boyd, Thomson anyway - they are no longer our players so why would we wish them to do poorly ?

 

Thommo is no bear, he never claimed to be and he gave his all in the shirt. We got a good fee for a guy with 12 months (he could have sat out and got himself more cash but didnt and he could have done it VERY easily, he had plenty of suitors and could have told bain to ram it when offered the move. he saw it was the best thing for ALL concerned and went) and he leaves with no ill will. Boyd, the Rangers fan, left us in the worst possible way.

 

Why was there not the same furore over Lovenkrands when he did the same thing as Boyd ? Just because finances were slightly better then ? Why did he get a heroes reception today ?

 

You missed it. get the people who hate FF but love to go there looking for things to moan about to highlight some of todays posts. At the time of him going he was absolutely pilloried on FF and again today there was a 33-33-33 split between hates loves and couldnt care less.

 

 

The day FF represents the wider support is the day we all best chuck it.

Roll on the new season I say

 

 

Amen brother.

[craig 5,199]

I am not sure we are that far away from actually arguing the same point NL

 

You think he should have considered the club in his decision and not just himself. I dont.

 

You and I will never be able to convince each other either way. The beauty of opinion

[wabashcannonball 0]

If playing in Europe meant so much to him then pray why did he join Middlesbrough? Silly illogical argument designed solely at blaming a manager you don't like

 

You are young, you confuse don't like with don't rate as highly as you or others do, it's an opinion it's like arseholes everybody has one, cheque book managers have never been Rangers style, until Minty arrived.

[Guest Northampton_loyalist]

I am not sure we are that far away from actually arguing the same point NL

 

You think he should have considered the club in his decision and not just himself. I dont.

 

You and I will never be able to convince each other either way. The beauty of opinion

 

That has been my point from the begining With a few exceptions the facts are pretty clear in all of this. You look at it one way and me another. Fuck me it would be boring if we all just held hands singing kumbayah

[Guest Northampton_loyalist]

You are young, you confuse don't like with don't rate as highly as you or others do, it's an opinion it's like arseholes everybody has one, cheque book managers have never been Rangers style, until Minty arrived.

 

do you think the contract offer was genuine? As argued above, Boyd didnt argue with the content of the contract, figures to be paid etc, only that he had not seen a hard copy and therefore could not be certain it was rubberstamped by the bank. If the offer was made and real, surely that would need to have been sanctioned by Smith, something he is unlikely to do considering the high value if he neither liked nor rated Boyd and was going to bench him for long periods?

 

If you dont think the offer was real there is no real arguement against it, it just depends how far you believe they would go to pull the wool over our eyes. I have a feeling you are slightly less willing to believe anything than me

[wabashcannonball 0]

do you think the contract offer was genuine? As argued above, Boyd didnt argue with the content of the contract, figures to be paid etc, only that he had not seen a hard copy and therefore could not be certain it was rubberstamped by the bank. If the offer was made and real, surely that would need to have been sanctioned by Smith, something he is unlikely to do considering the high value if he neither liked nor rated Boyd and was going to bench him for long periods?

 

If you dont think the offer was real there is no real arguement against it, it just depends how far you believe they would go to pull the wool over our eyes. I have a feeling you are slightly less willing to believe anything than me

 

To be honest NL I have been round the block to many times to believe anything that comes out of Ibrox from any source, Smith changes his mind to suit his audience and his paymaster, like it or not he is welded to Minty and his shenanigans.

 

Your opinion is your opinion and I respect that, as I respect everyones, message boards would be pointless if we all agreed.

 

I was told that Boyd more or less refused to be bullied by Smith, I believe that to be the case you may not, it is a matter of choice.

 

My opinion on Smith is well documented, Rangers must be one of the easiest managers jobs in fitba, not exactly a great deal of competition, Everton found him out and his lack of tactical nouse.

 

I published a pure stats record earlier today, and I did add the rider about lies, damned lies and stats, you should read it, makes for interesting comparisons.

[Super_Ally 0]

look, last time and very simply for you.....

 

 

I wrote my thoughts and a full explaination.....ok?

 

 

you complained that it was garbage and then moaned about the lack of debate being a symptom of the fact I also post on FF (note well, I am not an FF poster, I post on FF, amongst several other sites).....still with me?

 

You added nothing at that point other than . No reason why I was wrong, no reason why you were right, no counter to any of my points. just a . AFTER you had complained about a lack of debate......ok?

 

You pretty obviously then complained in one breath about a lack of debate while offering NOTHING other than a pathetic dig and an emote.....ok?

 

I pointed this idiotic hypocracy to you and you lost the plot. It really is that simple.

 

 

You give people warnings for calling you a cunt when they said no such thing. You are absolutely not worth another seconds talking to and worth far less than you have seen so far. So, lets leave it here

 

 

 

You are happy to rip into other boards while behaving in EXACTLY the way you dislike from them. You are nothing short of a hypocrite. Adeiu

 

If I "lost the plot" it's pretty apparent i'm not the only one.

 

I had started to write a full reply but you're getting pretty emotional and I don't think it would get us anywhere.

 

Ps. The FF generalisation may have been poor form. I was not meaning to tar all posters there with the same brush. Clearly I post there too. I am just amazed by the disproportionate number of nutters/timposters comapred to here and was suprised anyone could hold such extreme views. All been lost now in our quarrel.

[craig 5,199]

Back to the topic of the thread - if not the actual OP.

 

Former employees.....

 

Personally I actually hope that any of our former employees do well at their new clubs - but for MF.... unless that former employee (Mr Miller....) ends up at the darkside of Glasgow.

 

I have very, very rarely, wish ill on any of our former players - even with Kenny Miller, the only reason I wished him poor form was because he played for Celtic and, even then, was because they are our main rivals and challengers.

 

I, personally, simply don't understand why we would wish ill on any of our former players unless they are playing for another SPL team, a team we meet in Europe (which would inly be a one-off anyway) or someone who has slagged us off. Aside from that I am at a loss as to why we would wish ill on any of our former employees.

 

I am not a Middlesborough fan so dont really care as to whether they go up or not. As for Boyd and Thomson I hope they do well for their new team, even if they are immersed with a bunch of ex-Tims. Both of them served us well, both of them were contributors to 2 championship wins, multiple cup wins and an unforgettable run to the UEFA Cup final - and I, for one, thank them for those contributions.

[Gribz 745]

Anyway BBC report said Thomson had a good game. Boyd's name wasnt mentioned.

 

Ex-Rangers man Kevin Thomson - one of six former Old Firm players in Boro's starting XI - dictated the pace for periods in the centre of the park, while the occasional measured crossfield pass from right-back Justin Hoyte stretched Town on the opposite flank.

 

My own personal opinion is Boyd wont be such a hit nor score nearly as many goals. As will the others in general. Mcmanus, Flood, Robson, Miller and Boyd were average SPL players so to build a team around that wont be good enough for promotion IMO.