Walter Smith

[spanner 0]

I really don't think you get the economic side at all. If money to spend is equal everywhere then surely Petrescu must be the best manager in the World after spending "fourpence halpenny"?

 

Surely Seville and Stuttgart should be also be firing their managers? And should any other club who doesn't get to the second round of the CL after spending significantly more than the Romanian champs?

 

Yeah, makes a lot of sense. It's a bit like saying Walter Smith is a fantastic manager for getting Rangers to the UEFA cup final ahead of all those rich English, German and Italian teams. But maybe not eh? Doesn't fit your agenda.

 

I also find it amusing that you say Walter Smith never has good luck - is that not your little negative nancy club's standard theory about how we got to the UEFA final and won 4 trophies in the last two seasons?

 

Which is it to be?

 

I do not remember mentioning good luck, you highlighted WS's misfortune as to deflections etc, as for Petrescu being the best manager in the world you said that not me, in European terms he has shown himself to be less of a diddy then WS, nothing more nothing less, you appear to know the cost of everything and the value of nothing, but that surprises me not one bit, your logic is illogical.

 

ETA. your asertion of 5 million, is a total red herring, Rangers have drawn the player pool from a population of approximately 600 million worldwide.

Edited November 27, 2009 by spanner

[calscot 0]

I do not remember mentioning good luck, you highlighted WS's misfortune as to deflections etc, as for Petrescu being the best manager in the world you said that not me, in European terms he has shown himself to be less of a diddy then WS, nothing more nothing less, you appear to know the cost of everything and the value of nothing, but that surprises me not one bit, your logic is illogical.

 

ETA. your asertion of 5 million, is a total red herring, Rangers have drawn the player pool from a population of approximately 600 million worldwide.

 

Petrescu has done very little in Europe so far. To be honest he must be the luckest manager of the year. We miss a penalty against him at Ibrox and then they score from three deflections. They score at last minute equaliser against us at home. They score a late goal against Seville which is headed in by Seville player.

 

Does that sound like a great manager or a purple patch?

 

Anyone can get one string of results with a bit of luck and the man you hate so much did it two seasons ago. How has Putrescu shown he�s less of a diddy when Walter almost won the first CL and has gone to a UEFA final?

 

What will Unirea do next year? Will they even be in the CL? Will Dan be a diddy if they get put out in the qualifiers by the Bulgarian champs?

 

Romania are 16 places above us in the FIFA rankings and we�re dropping like brick. What makes you think our champs should be pissing all over their�s? We certainly competed with them on the park but as any knowledgeable football fan knows, you need a bit of luck as well. Only someone with little grasp of the game thinks a score-line always reflects the difference between the teams.

 

Take away a bad penalty, a couple of deflected goals and a stupid Novo pass and weââ?¬â?¢d looking at a draw and a win minimum ââ?¬â?? but themââ?¬â?¢s the breaks in football and it would be a less enjoyable game without them. You can go on about aunts and balls all you like but it only shows up an ignorance.

 

The fact is, we lost and drew, but anyone with any nous should be able to spot it�s not because we are a much poorer team. If we played 11 times, I�d be confident of at least taking the series 6-5 based on what I saw.

 

But it�s obvious which way you want to spin it.

 

As for the money, have you ever been to Romania? Last time I went, a beer was 40p, a meal was about 3 quid and a house was about 10 grand.

 

The best of local talent are usually at local market prices and they have a lot more kids to choose from who play football every day instead of play playstation, and who are thin and fit instead of fat and lazy.

 

To put down the Romanian champions as cannon fodder just because they are not as rich as our SPL (even in it�s impoverished state), is just western, capitalist arrogance.

 

I could probably have bought 10 houses for the price of mine in Romania, does that make me a diddy house buyer?

 

 

Rangers drawing on 600 million? Do you really believe that? Is that why our team has mostly Scots and NI in it? Tell me then, why are the rest of our teams so crap in Europe? Why are Celtic even worse than we are?

 

Seems a big coincidence that we're all suffering from the same symptoms when we're all global...

[elderslieblue 0]

Like many Rangers supporters, I suppose I'm not too happy with our failure in Europe and Walter is obviously the man to carry the can for that.

 

Without going back in history and dredging up the 10 IAR failure, I don't think that anybody could argue Walter has been a very successful manager for us. Would anybody else have been able to lift that team after the PLG fiasco ? [and I'd prefer to leave the arguement re PLG for another thread.]

 

There are better managers out there. No doubt. But could we afford them ? Would they be willing to come to Ibrox and work with the squad we have in the full knowledge that there's no money to bring in replacements ? And would they be any more successful than Walter in managing the team domestically ?

 

We are at the top of the SPL. Never mind the 'mhanks are p!sh' arguement. I've bought apples from that barrow before. They MIGHT throw a few million at new players in January but given Monkeyheids track record I don't see that making a difference to who'll be champions this year. We are TOP and I for one am certain we'll win the League this season. And even if they DO buy a couple of players, Walter can't be blamed for that.

 

 

Time to wake up Bears.............

 

There's NO money. NO new signings will be made. We'll have to make do with what's in the dressing room at the moment. And, unless Walter walks away, he'll be there until / if the Club is bought over.

 

Forget Europe. The beancounters at Ibrox have. The SPL is the maximum they are aiming for in the hope we get a monetary bonus of a couple of C.L. qualifiers.

 

I'm NOT happy with that. But that's just the way things are and I don't see any change in the immediate future.

[spanner 0]

I see you are floundering in deep water, someone may come along and throw you a lifebelt, as the lifeboat like your logic appears to be going round in circles. I hope you find the point of whatever it is you are trying to make, somehow I very much doubt, you are without doubt a true fan.

[calscot 0]

To me it's Scottish football as well as society that's in deep water and other countries outside the top five may join us. Rangers are in deep water in other senses as well, and looking for a lifebelt.

 

To make a scapegoat out of one man with no-one to replace him and no solution to our underlying problems doesn't help anybody. And to me that's burying heads in the sand.

 

Walter may not be the best manager around but I can't think of one that would we could realistically get who would turn us around. However, Walter does seem to know how to win the SPL and be a close second when he doesn't quite do it. No other Rangers manager in my lifetime had that knack.

 

I think to get our heads out of the sand and be "realistic" as well as to enjoy our football in any way, for a while we have to concentrate in our own parochial backyard and compete with our peers who are affected by the same malaise.

 

Any CL football is a bonus where we're likely to fail and the best we can expect in Europe is a wee run in the Europa cup. As far as I can tell that apart from a handful purple patches, and a couple of times where we could compete financially, it's never really been any other way with Rangers throughout our history.

 

I really don't know where our jumped up expectations come from.

 

Our real problems are first sorting out the ownership of our club and getting it on a sustainable financial footing and then it's in tackling the SPL and our society, where, if we are ever to compete way above the natural position of a small provincial country, we have to do something special, something different, where we invest time and money in changing our society to a more healthy and fitter population who see sport as an essential activity to do pretty much every day.

 

We have to change the attitudes of the next generation to eat better, to smoke and binge drink less, to keep fitter and to put their energy and aggression into the likes of football rather than getting pissed and having knife fights.

 

Until stuff like that is sorted we have to see the picture how it is instead of changing the manager from one mediocre one to the next every year or two as some kind of attempt at symptomatic relief. Sticking a plaster on a gushing artery ain't gonna help.

[spanner 0]

To me it's Scottish football as well as society that's in deep water and other countries outside the top five may join us. Rangers are in deep water in other senses as well, and looking for a lifebelt.

 

To make a scapegoat out of one man with no-one to replace him and no solution to our underlying problems doesn't help anybody. And to me that's burying heads in the sand.

 

Walter may not be the best manager around but I can't think of one that would we could realistically get who would turn us around. However, Walter does seem to know how to win the SPL and be a close second when he doesn't quite do it. No other Rangers manager in my lifetime had that knack.

 

I think to get our heads out of the sand and be "realistic" as well as to enjoy our football in any way, for a while we have to concentrate in our own parochial backyard and compete with our peers who are affected by the same malaise.

 

Any CL football is a bonus where we're likely to fail and the best we can expect in Europe is a wee run in the Europa cup. As far as I can tell that apart from a handful purple patches, and a couple of times where we could compete financially, it's never really been any other way with Rangers throughout our history.

 

I really don't know where our jumped up expectations come from.

 

Our real problems are first sorting out the ownership of our club and getting it on a sustainable financial footing and then it's in tackling the SPL and our society, where, if we are ever to compete way above the natural position of a small provincial country, we have to do something special, something different, where we invest time and money in changing our society to a more healthy and fitter population who see sport as an essential activity to do pretty much every day.

 

We have to change the attitudes of the next generation to eat better, to smoke and binge drink less, to keep fitter and to put their energy and aggression into the likes of football rather than getting pissed and having knife fights.

 

Until stuff like that is sorted we have to see the picture how it is instead of changing the manager from one mediocre one to the next every year or two as some kind of attempt at symptomatic relief. Sticking a plaster on a gushing artery ain't gonna help.

 

This pair look suitably chagrined... http://www.snspix.com/image/1873279_1873279.jpg

 

http://www.snspix.com/prints-28967/27-11-09-rangers-training-gallery.html?PHPSESSID=a40b834be0fa37dccb3fedeb77ca94fe

Edited November 27, 2009 by spanner

[maineflyer 0]

All the talk of sacking WS is crazy at this time,IMO. I do agree WS is probably not the manager to take us forward,

to be fair though Ian, it's not crazy. It might be precipitate or even rash but surely not crazy. If, as many do, you think he's not the man to take us forward the surely that's accepting that he will have to go at some stage and even implies that sooner is probably better.

 

...... but I can't think of any other manager I would want in charge right now,or who would actually want it, and until our financial predicament is sorted out I can't see that changing.

Again, the inability of fans, individually or collectively, to identify a replacement manager cannot, in all honesty, be the determining factor in replacing a manager. Fans are seldom well enough informed to make such a determination, either about the choices or disposition of manager who might be available, or of the clubs ability or intent to attract given candidates. You (or my) inability to identify credible candidates can hardly support a case for it being crazy to try.

 

We all knew we were not good enough to compete in the CL before we entered it, didn't we?,dissapointed ?yes,surprised?,no. I will now be accused of burying my head in the sand, fair enough, but I'll stick with WS until the end of the season thanks.

I certainly won't be accusing you of any such thing. We're all entitled to our opinions. Some days we're more relfective, other we're prone to more assertive statements. You want Walter Smith to stay until the end of the season, or at least you're prepared to accept that arrangement. Others think a more proactive and immediate change would be better for the club. Without actual insight into club's situation, or the nature or availability of candidate managers, the truth is none of us are in any position to judge what's best. We all just take punts based on what we do know but I think all of us need to accept we just ain't best placed to take dogmatic positions on this.

 

All I know? is that there are many problems to be overcome, both on and off the field, and there are people whose responsibility (even in law) it is to act in the best interests of the club (company) and to address and solve these problems. They may well be doing so but I see no actual sign of it yet.

 

In the case of Walter Smith, I would welcome his departure today but only insomuch as that was possible because a new and more capable manager had been found and appointed. If no such replacement is found then it makes emminent good sense to carry on as we are for the time being.

 

I think we need to separate the wish to see Walter move on as a sign of progess - and the wish to see him leave because he's actively continuing to contribute to a growing problem. I think he is indeed part of the problem but the degree to which Walter Smith's management abilities will further damage the club over the timeframe of (say) the rest of this season will be negligible. For that reason, as I said in a previous post elsewhere, I'm increasingly ambivalent about pursuing the departure of Walter Smith. The game is being played on another level altogether and it's already certain that Walter's departure will be part of the cure rather than the cure itself.

 

There is some unattractive comment flying around this forum these last couple of days, especially from established posters who should know better. Whatever the reasons for this, Walter Smith shouldn't be one of them.

[Super_Ally 0]

I see you are floundering in deep water, someone may come along and throw you a lifebelt, as the lifeboat like your logic appears to be going round in circles. I hope you find the point of whatever it is you are trying to make, somehow I very much doubt, you are without doubt a true fan.

 

A bucket-load of irony in this post.

[spanner 0]

A bucket-load of irony in this post.

 

Bit of a magnet for you then. :fish:

[Norris Cole 0]

Fuck me this is tiresome.