Alan Gow

[calscot 0]

Which is an error on Rangers part, not Gows.

 

Also, money isn't a factor in this discussion. I'm ont really fussed if he's earning 250k a year or whether you were unemployed after graduating or not.

 

I'm asking why he was watched/scouted by WS then signed by WS only for him to rot away.

 

If it turns out he wasn't good enough to play for us then someone at Rangers made a mistake. If he fucked up somewhere down the line while at Rangers then it's his fault. I suppose we'll never know.

 

Managers are never perfect, employees don't always turn out as hoped - moreso in football, and players often alienate themselves from the manager.

 

Player turnover in football is huge so if our manager doesn't get it right now and again and doesn't waste too much money in getting it wrong then I'm fine with that.

 

I also don't see how Gow "rotted away" and if was so bad, why did he turn down a reasonable transfer?Why do some players choose to rot than go somewhere else?

 

I'm sure if Gow had been a model professional, got on with everyone including the management and showed more ability than other players in the squad, he would have been picked for the team.

 

I really doubt that he displayed all those attributes, but I still doubt he fully regrets going to Rangers, as it seems money is the most important thing to players these days.

[Gribz 972]

Eh, pretty simple. For example, I could pick up an apple, see it looks a bit bruised and reject it without trying it. Is it so hard to understand?

 

LOL, thats not exactly a reason, thats judging a book by its cover. You could look at Luke chadwick or Frank Ribery and say they look like bad apples but until they kick a ball we cant tell. Gow played what 2 games for Rangers? And he was them most impressive guy in pre season tour of the States at the time and this was following being Falkirks best player. So he was hardly a reject.

 

Every player we signed who didn't produce the goods and was moved on.

Personally I dont care what a player has done at a previous club, Id rather see them get a chance when playing for us. Boumsong, Cuellar and Bougherra are perfect examples of players who were unheard of who turned out to be brilliant in the blue jersey, crikey Laudrup was struggling at Fiorentina prior coming to us. Of course it can work the other way with the likes of Jeffers, Maniero, Mlandovic but my point is a player should still be judged at the present and for Rangers.

 

There are many reasons to reject anything, we don't know the whole story about Gow, whether he's rejected is up to Smith.

But for a football team surely its just down to what he can on the park along with conduct off it. Im pretty sure some of the 9IAR team got up to worse things off the park. It seems whatever Gow did was personal to WS and in turn he made sure the guy never kicked a ball from him. It was a personal thing from WS - IMO thats no reason not to pick someone especially when we were screaming out for a fresh pair of legs in 2 certain positions.

 

Bougherra may have been a reject at another club but that doesn't make him a Rangers reject.

Yip, and that goes back to my point about I dont care what other players do before they sign for Rangers. They may come with poor reputations but we shouldnt judge until we have seen on a consistantly basis. Ally McCoist used to get booed in his early days - I cant think of a better example on how to persivere with a player!

 

That's easy enough to say but the point that Walter got there in the first place suggests he was doing something right. I really can't see how picking Gow would have won us UEFA cup. Walter didn't think he had it in him and I respect that decision from a manager who got us to the final.

Nobody is saying Gow would have won us the UEFA cup or the SPL, but he MAY have been the difference along with Buffel had they been given some games. Its irrevlent now but the question of this thread was 'should he been given a chance' - my answer is yes.

 

That's a bit cringeworthy - I didn't realise that going to some games gives you better credentials to make managerial decisions than Walter Smith... anyway well done you for going to more games than me.

 

I really expected better from you as you used to be a very good poster, but now you're taking things far too personally and I now expect a petty groan from you every time I disagree with you.

 

Let me tell you now, my posts are generally not personal, I think things through logically and often come up with different conclusions than others. Feel free to disagree with them but please try to understand them first- it might be interesting to see an explanation of a different viewpoint to your own, and I do try to make some kind of sense.

 

If I disagree with you, it's not likely to be a personal attack

You're the one who says an armchair fan shouldnt be in a position to decide, but IIRC your the biggest armchair fan on here and you have admitted that in the past that you prefer to watch games on TV - there isnt anything wrong with that. But I try to get to games whenever possible and if i make the trip home I always make sure I get to one game - for me you still cant beat the feeling of waking up and having a day trip to Ibrox.

 

And I havent taken things personally or petty at all, if anyone has then its you as your the one who brought that up, but in no way have I thought you were being personal. You have had some cracking debates over the years so there is no way I would assume you were being personal at me. I just thought this was another debate thats all.

 

Edited September 8, 2009 by Gribz

[calscot 0]

LOL, thats not exactly a reason, thats judging a book by its cover. You could look at Luke chadwick or Frank Ribery and say they look like bad apples but until they kick a ball we cant tell. Gow played what 2 games for Rangers? And he was them most impressive guy in pre season tour of the States at the time and this was following being Falkirks best player. So he was hardly a reject.

 

Well Walter did more than look at him, he had a small taste and decided the apple was sour - or he read some of the book but thought it was pulp fiction.

 

Walter saw Gow in training and on a day to day professional basis and made his decision from that. To me it seems Gow's level of talent, whatever that is, was not enough to overcome some other deficiency which Walter didn't like.

 

Anyway, the trouble is about trying players out is that you only get 11 players on the pitch at a time and the result stands regardless of who you play. It's not like you get to play the game three times with different teams and get to take the best result. There is a hell of a lot of pressure on a Rangers manager to win every game, we all know this, and so you can understand a Rangers manager not risking a player whom he decides is not up to the task for whatever reason.

 

Personally I dont care what a player has done at a previous club, Id rather see them get a chance when playing for us. Boumsong, Cuellar and Bougherra are perfect examples of players who were unheard of who turned out to be brilliant in the blue jersey, crikey Laudrup was struggling at Fiorentina prior coming to us. Of course it can work the other way with the likes of Jeffers, Maniero, Mlandovic but my point is a player should still be judged at the present and for Rangers.

 

I think we're agreeing here as I never said anything about what players had done at a previous club. Rejects are only rejected after being sized up at Rangers after signing for us. It's nothing to do with their previous career - except maybe taking into account their potential. A manager may be more patient with a misfitting Ronaldo than he his with the likes of Burke.

 

But for a football team surely its just down to what he can on the park along with conduct off it. Im pretty sure some of the 9IAR team got up to worse things off the park. It seems whatever Gow did was personal to WS and in turn he made sure the guy never kicked a ball from him. It was a personal thing from WS - IMO thats no reason not to pick someone especially when we were screaming out for a fresh pair of legs in 2 certain positions.

 

The 9IAR team were winning everything, had a great camaraderie and also had the right attitude towards training and towards their manager. We don't know what the story is with Gow but if nothing else, Walter has a great reputation for dealing with players. However, he can only achieve that by having a line that you mustn't cross or you get full his wrath - as Barry Ferguson did. Otherwise he'd get less respect.

 

It seems probable that Gow crossed that line - or maybe he just couldn't fit in the team. Who knows.

 

I like Walter's style when it comes to players and on the occasion when one get's on his bad side I fully support him. I think it makes him a very strong man manager and Barry has shown that's something that both PLG and Burley lack. I could never see Walter losing the dressing room like those two.

 

Nobody is saying Gow would have won us the UEFA cup or the SPL, but he MAY have been the difference along with Buffel had they been given some games. Its irrevlent now but the question of this thread was 'should he been given a chance' - my answer is yes.

 

May have, may not have, who knows. Maybe if we played him instead of Beasley or Adam, we wouldn't have got to the final at all. It's pure speculation and the pedigree of the player does give much evidence that he could have improved the team enough to beat a very good and more expensive side - especially in what is not his natural position...

 

You're the one who says an armchair fan shouldnt be in a position to decide,

 

I used "armchair fan" as a cover all term - season ticket holders are not much better placed to take over management from Walter Smith. The point is that the criticism was getting a bit presumptuous - it sounded like people think they know how to micro manage a team better than our current manager - when to me that is his strength. If he was as unsuccessful as PLG then you'd have a point, but to imply you know how to win a UEFA cup or a treble better than Walter Smith gets a bit much.

 

The point I made was that it takes a very good manager to get within striking distance and just because he is unable to win both in extreme circumstances, does not make him suddenly clueless. And really I can't see that playing a player who has shown nothing at the highest level could really have been the answer.

 

but IIRC your the biggest armchair fan on here and you have admitted that in the past that you prefer to watch games on TV - there isnt anything wrong with that.

 

I think you're implying there is. And I don't prefer to watch on TV although I'm not blind to the advantages.

 

I find it difficult to get to Rangers games due to where I live and when I visit Scotland I often struggle to fit it in when there is actually a game I can get to.

 

If I lived closer, I'd probably go to about 10 to 15 games a season - I've been to a few Dons games last season even though I don't support them. I probably wouldn't go to more as I've so many other things I like doing.

 

I suppose I could fly up every fortnight but I'm not prepared to do that. Some people would say that behaviour shows I'm a great fan, others would see it as very sad. Life to me, is not about how many games you get to.

 

I doubt most of the stuff I debate/argue about requires you to go to see every game live and then watch it again on Rangers TV.

 

The "armchair fan" was no slight at anyone - but the fact is, no fan is really in the position to say he would be able to make certain personnel decisions better than a pretty successful manager - a shit manager maybe.

 

If it's so easy to win a UEFA cup by picking one player - then why couldn't Advocaat or McLeish do it?

 

In the end not every player can make it at Rangers and Gow has hardly been badly treated in that respect. Unless he's naive, he knew that it would be difficult to break into the team but he signed anyway - his reward is multiplying his wages probably by about 4 and then moving onto a club to suit his ability with vastly raised earning potential - I'm sure he'll be earning a lot more than if he'd gone to the Championship direct.

 

He's maybe learned a lesson or two from Walter on the way.

[UCF2008 0]

We'll probably never know if there was more to Gow's situation at Rangers than met the eye. It could just be that he happened to be at Rangers at a time when the squad was bloated and opportunities were limited. To an extent this situation could be blamed on the management as a whole, but at the same time, when WS took over it was clear that the squad needed rebuilding and as a free transfer, Gow was a low risk addition to the squad.

 

With the under-21 rule in the SPL it makes it even more difficult for fringe players to get their chance to impress. Even with a squad full of world class players you can only get away with so much squad rotation before you start to unsettle the consistency of performance, so with a group as large as we had there was always going to be a handful of players who were surplus to requirements. As it turned out, Gow was one of those players.