Grass Roots Football - How Can We Learn From Holland?

[Zappa 0]

Good article pete!

 

Something that I think is seriously worth looking at in relation to how & why football in Holland is working so well on the community level as you describe, is the fact that Holland is so densely populated. Holland is under half the size of Scotland in terms of it's area, yet it has over 16.5 million people in comparison to Scotland's 5 to 6 million. That gives Holland a population density of over 6 times that of Scotland & makes Holland amongst the most densely populated countries in the world (top 20-30). The only places in the whole of Europe that are more densely populated are small Islands & the likes of the vatican. Even if you take into account the fact that a large percentage of Scotland's population are packed into Central Scotland, Holland would probably still be more densely populated. The reason I'm pointing this out, is that's exactly why you can say: "no matter how good or bad you are then there will be a club within a ten minute bicycle ride" & Sturing can say: “To have so many local clubs for such a small country is amazing, because the base of the pyramid is so big there is a lot of quality at the top". In no way am I saying that something similar couldn't work in Scotland's heavier populated areas, but there's definitely going to be a big difference forced on any community systems here simply because of the size & geography of this countries' population. A reasonably large percentage of Scotland's small population actually don't live in the densely populated 'central belt' & probably couldn't jump onto a push bicycle to get to football training.

 

I personally think all we could do is look at Holland as having a good model & try to work out how it might be adapted into something similar here rather than thinking that we can copy it, when we probably can't.

 

 

Firstly football in Holland is based on being a community sport. Clubs are formed in Holland to give anyone who wants to play football the chance to play football. There is no looking in newspapers to try and find a team if you want to play - no matter how good or bad you are then there will be a club within a ten minute bicycle ride.

 

In Holland the pyramid is very big,” explains Sturing, making a triangle with his two hands. “To have so many local clubs for such a small country is amazing, because the base of the pyramid is so big there is a lot of quality at the top".

Edited June 15, 2009 by Zappa
editing typos

[Guest wilkie1984]

I think Scotland could and should learn alot about how the game is run in Holland. I have said it for years about Rangers actually going to talk to Ajax and see what their setup actually involves.

 

One thing we can say though is we may well be seeing some good young players starting to emerge from the club the likes of John Fleck, Danny Wilson and the boy little.

 

Maybe just maybe things are looking good for the future!

[pete 2,499]

Pete, it starts at under 7's and goes up to under 21's and then they would move onto the amateur side(s), so there is a home for them there.

 

There isn't an association with any professional or semi-professional (junior) teams as such.

 

Most prof teams here do have an amateur part to the set-up although they are probably financially divided. The amateur section of Feynoord has just helped the prof section out of the shit. I believe they dropped their claim to their share of rental payments as the amateurs own half of the Kuip and receive payments from the prof section.

[pete 2,499]

Great article Pete - I've thanked you on your last message as if I thanked your article it would go to Frankie...

 

It's gratifying that it echos stuff I've been suggesting for a long time - organised teams with coaching in every town subsidised by the government and the crucial factor that EVERYONE who comes along gets a game and coaching.

 

It would create a massive increase in participation of the sport that would obviously bring benefits to our professional and international game as well as creating more fans who go to games and even reducing obesity which I'll bet is a lot lower in Holland.

 

I would have loved to have such a set-up when I was young as what we had was a first team at school and if you didn't get in, tough. That's not good for late developers or those without much coaching by their dads etc.

 

I found most player in the teams had active dads who played themselves which gave all of them a head start; whereas, my dad was away at sea a lot, didn't like football anyway and my parents were divorced by the time I was 8.

 

I therefore didn't learn to play football well enough to get in the school team and so didn't play much and certainly didn't get any coaching - and at that time you couldn't learn from the internet or dvd's either.

 

I didn't actually play really regular kickabout football until I was about 30 and started as one of the worst players. However, I worked at my game learned from websites, dvds and things that are really obvious when your an adult but not as a kid - like pulling your foot back to kill the ball which is so natural to those who have been coached as a youngster - but was something I really had to concentrate on for a long time; or always being half-turned when receiving the ball.

 

I improved dramatically and enough to eventually be of a standard to play for my work's veteran team by the time I was 37.

 

I really regret not being able to play and develop my game as a youngster and throughout my life - and that Dutch system would have made my footballing life so much different...

 

I really feel it is a such a waste of talent to bring young guy's through a boy's club and then say at the end of it "that's it go find yourself an amateur team. My nephew was a really good player but he lost the way when he went to an amateur team and felt uneasy and an outsider looking in. Being unhappy affected his game and he stopped playing.

In Holland he would still have been playing with players he was brought up with. Many, maybe most clubs let there u21 team stay together in the senior section for a year or two to make the crossover a bit easier. Obviously players good enough for the 1st-2nd team are fished out. These are replaced by a few more experienced players to help with the transition period.

The nuclease of these teams sometimes stay together all the way through the senior level as a friend team with just the odd addition now and again for people who leave.

[pete 2,499]

Good article pete!

 

Something that I think is seriously worth looking at in relation to how & why football in Holland is working so well on the community level as you describe, is the fact that Holland is so densely populated. Holland is under half the size of Scotland in terms of it's area, yet it has over 16.5 million people in comparison to Scotland's 5 to 6 million. That gives Holland a population density of over 6 times that of Scotland & makes Holland amongst the most densely populated countries in the world (top 20-30). The only places in the whole of Europe that are more densely populated are small Islands & the likes of the vatican. Even if you take into account the fact that a large percentage of Scotland's population are packed into Central Scotland, Holland would probably still be more densely populated. The reason I'm pointing this out, is that's exactly why you can say: "no matter how good or bad you are then there will be a club within a ten minute bicycle ride" & Sturing can say: ââ?¬Å?To have so many local clubs for such a small country is amazing, because the base of the pyramid is so big there is a lot of quality at the top". In no way am I saying that something similar couldn't work in Scotland's heavier populated areas, but there's definitely going to be a big difference forced on any community systems here simply because of the size & geography of this countries' population. A reasonably large percentage of Scotland's small population actually don't live in the densely populated 'central belt' & probably couldn't jump onto a push bicycle to get to football training.

 

I personally think all we could do is look at Holland as having a good model & try to work out how it might be adapted into something similar here rather than thinking that we can copy it, when we probably can't.

 

Obviously people who live deep in the country here also have to travel further to play i did mean in towns and villages. The fact is you have Boy's clubs, amateur, and Junior level all apart. Why can't that be pulled into one club. Why are boys who are too old for the youth system thrown on the street to find an amateur club for themselves. Pollock, Renfrew juniors, Maryhill to name a few could have a full youth\amateur system behind them producing talent and money instead of just one team depending on a few hundred\thousand supporters and sponsers to keep them afloot.

It is crazy for me.

[Zappa 0]

Obviously people who live deep in the country here also have to travel further to play i did mean in towns and villages. The fact is you have Boy's clubs, amateur, and Junior level all apart. Why can't that be pulled into one club. Why are boys who are too old for the youth system thrown on the street to find an amateur club for themselves. Pollock, Renfrew juniors, Maryhill to name a few could have a full youth\amateur system behind them producing talent and money instead of just one team depending on a few hundred\thousand supporters and sponsers to keep them afloot.

It is crazy for me.

 

I basically agree with you in principle pete, but there's other aspects of what you're saying that bother me apart from the population density difference. You mention the 'canteens' selling 'beverages' as being the major source of income, but I can't see that working here in Scotland. I don't think that licensed bars attached to youth football would be particularly successful here, even if they were actually allowed/condoned & licensed in the first place. Selling beer & wine isn't a way to fund youth football imo, but if it works in Holland fair play to those who make it work. Holland is a rather strange country that doesn't exactly go with 'the norm' after all.

[pete 2,499]

I basically agree with you in principle pete, but there's other aspects of what you're saying that bother me apart from the population density difference. You mention the 'canteens' selling 'beverages' as being the major source of income, but I can't see that working here in Scotland. I don't think that licensed bars attached to youth football would be particularly successful here, even if they were actually allowed/condoned & licensed in the first place. Selling beer & wine isn't a way to fund youth football imo, but if it works in Holland fair play to those who make it work. Holland is a rather strange country that doesn't exactly go with 'the norm' after all.

 

Renfrew Juniors have a club( not a supporter but i lived in Renfrew for a while) so it must be allowed. Bowling Greens have clubs where drink is sold. It must be possible .