Rousseau

12 minutes ago, der Berliner said:

Well, we know where we find John and Tavernier anyways ... and more often than not in recent OF games, Tav has lacked the discipline to stay in his place and defend well for 90 mins.

 

But the team against the Scum is essentially clear, with the only question mark hanging over Cummings or Morelos. Elsewhere it will be the same band that started against Hearts, unless Murty tries something "audacious" and plays - you guessed it - Windass from the start!

If we lack defensive "discipline" with Tavernier and Candeias, we're giving them a free run at goal with just Candeias. It's silly... IMO, of course.

 

Playing Windass is not "audacious"; in fact, it's the only way to go if we have any desire to press them.

5 minutes ago, der Berliner said:

In what way? I at least gave you some reason behind it, but you'll sure have a better line-up in store with a decent resoning behind it?

 

Martin is a right-sided centre-half who's played right-back before (and long spells). Candeias usually tracks back well too. Tavernier has been ineffective for about two months on the trott as wingback. Docherty and Holt to chase any wingers if need be.

 

Alves usually plays left of centre and it would fall down to Murphy to track back if need be, but more part of Docherty and Holt again. Given we play 4-x-y-z and leave our centre-halfs exposed anyway, McCrorie would be the additional guard, perhaps stepping out every now and then to break up attacks.

 

So what we'll have is a packed central defence, a solid midfield of workers and three creative people. Up front, Cummings and Morelos will keep their defenders on their toes, perhaps keepig their fullbacks deeper in their half than they were at Hampden. In any case, we'd have two people up there to aim our long(er) balls at than just Morelos.

 

John and Windass as later additions, Halliday to kick the Legoeaters crown jewells, if he finds them ...

It was more a dig at your Windass comment rather than anything else.

 

Although, I don't like, and can't see Murty, going with wingers at WB; it's just asking for trouble, IMO. 

If it's going to be a back-three/-five, it'll be Tavernier and John playing in the Wing-back positions. 

 

It'll be the same set-up as normal (4-2-3-1), with perhaps Cummings starting, and one of Docherty / Holt to partner Dorrans.

 

Windass will start, and has to, if we have any desire to press them. 

2 hours ago, der Berliner said:

We should play in Black, should leave the field if they go the sectarian route in the stands (after all, it is screened LIVE all over the planet), and if it goes the way of the last game, should accumulate the 5 red cards necessary to have the game abandoned. With Thomson in the middle, that should be do-able.

 

Back in the real world, Windass should'nt be anywhere near the starting line-up.

 

Alnwick

 

Martin - McCrorie - Alves

 

Docherty - Holt

 

Candeias - Dorrans - Murphy

 

Cummings - Morelos

 

We've made a hash of so many games against them trying to go with Docherty, Dorrans and Windass in the central spine that it beggars belief. Have Docherty and Holt kick the living shyte out of their midfield, while covering either flank, let Dorrans, Candeias and Murphy do the creative work and keep Cummings and Morelos harrassing their back-line.

Back in the real world, that set-up is silly.   

I'm kind-of coming around, but I'm still unsure. 

 

Some of the qualities I've read about Gerrard are encouraging. 

 

He needs experience beside him -- Nicholl can do that job --, but most importantly, IMO, he'll need a technical coach, someone to get the players set up properly, tactically and technically.  

With five words, delivered deliberately but emphatically, Steven Gerrard captured the way he played football and the way he now coaches football.

“My teams will be physical,” he says with an emphasis that underlines a determination to ensure that one of the game’s most basic and enduring qualities is not lost having already been watered down.

Asked how he will deliver on that ambition in a culture of showboating, Liverpool’s newly appointed under-18s manager does not take a backward step. “Fifty fifties,” he responds with a laugh that confirmed that he was joking about the strategy if not about the principle.

 

If the thought of Gerrard thundering into the kind of challenges that provided a physical edge to one of English football’s great careers is enough to bring the youngsters at Liverpool’s Academy out in a cold sweat, his tongue in cheek remark should not be taken literally.

 

But the throwaway line is in keeping with a long-held belief that to thrive at the highest level even the most talented players must combine physical intensity with individual skill.

 

Gerrard might not say that he agrees with critics of the academy system who claim giving children the best of everything guarantees only that they will be softened up, but the way he outlines his coaching vision indicates that the players who come under his tutelage will be expected to be as committed, both physically and mentally, as they are gifted.

“I think it is important that you channel it (aggression) in the right way,” Gerrard explains. “As a player, I got many, many tackles wrong and went over the top a few times and I had to come and apologise. That is not something I want to put into kids or young players at all, but you have to prepare them for the top level and the top level is physical and demanding and it is not just about tackles and competing. It is about trying to prepare them for the last five or 10 minutes of games when it is hard and your legs are burning and your heart is burning and it is not a nice place to be in as a player. But you have to get them to be mentally strong to be prepared for that.”

It isn’t that Gerrard is anti-talent, the opposite is actually true, but he does harbour a fear that some of the football influences that youngsters now come under are not always positive for their development and that is something that he intends to combat.

“There is a showboating mentality through academies,” he adds. “A lot of kids that play the games think they have to do 10 lollipops or Cruyff turns to look good or stand out. We all love a bit of skill and talent, I love all that, but the other side of the game is huge. It’s massive These players I have to try and prepare them for careers in the game. Not all of them will play for Liverpool’s first team, but I feel if I can help them to compete in the other side of the game it will help their careers.

“There are a lot of skilful players in the game that young players try and emulate – probably too much instead of trying to be themselves and playing to their own strengths. I think they try and emulate other players in the game and try and model their game on other players like a Cristiano Ronaldo or that type of player. Whereas you have to look at yourself and say, ‘What have I got? What are my strengths? How can I improve my weaknesses and become a player in my own right?’

“I like streetwise footballers. I think all the top players they come from the street that type of player. The kids in our academy are coming into an unbelievable place to work, they are getting boss food, they are getting picked up and the full-time lads get a lot more money now than we got we first started. There is a case where they get a little bit too much, too soon and they sort of get into that comfort zone of working in a lovely place and then it is a big shock for them when they have to move on or get released. So that is what you have to drive into the players that while they are here you have to make sacrifices and give it your best, don’t get too comfortable, because the hard work starts when you get out the academy.”

What Gerrard is outlining is the footballer’s graft bible, the philosophies of which he subscribed to as a player and which he now espouses on a daily basis at Liverpool’s Academy in Kirkby. Prior to confirmation of his elevation to taking charge of the club’s under-18s team, the former midfielder was given access to all age groups at training sessions and games in order to allow him to build up his experience and influence before a permanent role was decided upon.

 

During that period, those who worked under Gerrard and who watched him in action all came to the conclusion that he wanted them to – that he would settle for nothing but 100% effort and a desire to perform at the highest standard at all times.

 

Prior to confirmation of his elevation to taking charge of the club’s under-18s team, the former midfielder was given access to all age groups at training sessions and games in order to allow him to build up his experience and influence before a permanent role was decided upon. During that period, those who worked under Gerrard and who watched him in action all came to the conclusion that he wanted them to – that he would settle for nothing but 100% effort and a desire to perform at the highest standard at all times.

 

That became apparent early on during his “shadowing” phase when Gerrard would work alongside Liverpool’s various age group managers in order to learn on the job at the same time as giving players the benefit of his considerable experience. Two games, in particular, stand out from that period – a 2-0 win for the under-18s against Manchester City before which he gave his first ever team talk and a 2-2 draw for the same side away to Manchester United in a match in which they had been reduced to ten men – with many of those present taken aback by Liverpool’s physical approach on both occasions.

“You definitely get a buzz if the players deliver what you have asked for whether that it is half-time or before the game,” Gerrard admits. “But I am shadowing and assisting. It comes from the other coaches as well it is not just from me saying it to these players.  But I hate watching footballers and football when there is no physical side and you don’t compete. The key with this age group is development. Of

“But I am shadowing and assisting. It comes from the other coaches as well it is not just from me saying it to these players.  But I hate watching footballers and football when there is no physical side and you don’t compete. The key with this age group is development. Of course I want to win and the kids want to win as well but it can't be the be-all and end-all at that age. It is about their long-term development, trying to prepare them for their own careers, but once the game starts...”

Leaving that answer trailing is as deliberate as the sentiments behind it but while those who Gerrard is coaching are on a learning curve in terms of his expectations and style, so too is he as he works towards the completion of his A licence which the former England captain hopes to obtain before the end of this season.

As well as concluding those formalities, Gerrard has also been involved in a more informal process in which he has sought and taken the advice from Liverpool’s established coaches, ranging from first team manager Jurgen Klopp to Academy director Alex Inglethorpe and Steve Heighway who also managed him as a young player.

“It has been really good, I have enjoyed it,” he says. “I have been shadowing five or six coaches and been mentored by Steve Heighway and Alex Inglethorpe as well. But the 5-6 coaches ie Mick Garrity, Neil Critchley, Tommy Culshaw, Barry Lewtas from the under 14s and 15s all the way up they have all been an open book to me in terms of session plans and how they do it themselves. I have had licence to assist every single one of them in the games. I cannot really ask any more from the staff at the academy, they have all been brilliant. I am still obviously waiting for the first day to start in terms of being a No1 coach that leads a team, shadowing is a bit different. I am more in the background. I haven’t had to make any big decisions, or any substitutions, formations or tactics just yet. But I am really excited and looking forward to starting it next season.

“Alex has been first class and an open book and we've had chats and I've got a lot of feedback. The deal with him was 'If you're going to mentor me be honest and straight with me. If you see something I am doing wrong or you want me to change something then tell me because if you don't I'll never learn anything.”

Inglethorpe’s constructive criticism has been taken on board and Gerrard does not shy away from revealing the kind of advice he has been given. “Body language on the side in coaching sessions,” he specifies. “Alex also talked to me about my coaching voice and he wants it to be the same as it was when I was a player, when I was captain. He is very good.”

 

Gerrard describes his relationship with Klopp as “good” and “very strong” and the Liverpool manager helped his high profile protégé come to the conclusion that taking an under-18s team would be the ideal starting point for his coaching career. “It was a bit from me, a bit from Jurgen and a bit from Alex if you like,” Gerrard says. “I don’t know why I just got a connection with that age group. It is a place where I can go and make many, many mistakes because that is what I have been told I am going to do and I probably will do that. Every manager and coach I have spoken to

“It was a bit from me, a bit from Jurgen and a bit from Alex if you like,” Gerrard says. “I don’t know why I just got a connection with that age group. It is a place where I can go and make many, many mistakes because that is what I have been told I am going to do and I probably will do that. Every manager and coach I have spoken to has said I will make loads of mistakes, but your first job is better to be away from the cameras. But you still get that little bit of exposure with the U18s – LFC TV, doing interviews with the local paper and so on. I think it is a great age and a good idea to start there.

“The kids were a bit shy at first but once you start speaking to them as a group and start pulling them individually and they know you are approachable and you tell them that you are there for them and it is all about them then they get comfortable around you very, quickly. I will be approachable I think you have got to be. I will try and take all the best bits of all the managers I have worked with and the best managers, the ones I enjoyed working for, were all very approachable, always very honest and fair with me, always gave me feedback whether it was positive or negative. If those managers were fair and honest with me I would always respect them.

“I hope what I say to the players resonates with them because I've been through that process from the age of eight. I've had the injuries, I've had the highs and lows and that will help me moving forward as a manager and coach. I'll treat players how I expect to be treated myself. I’d love it if one of my players goes on to the first team. I'd love it for them because it is a life-changer. Making your debut for a club this size changed my life and I'll be pleased for that kid and his family because it is an unbelievable thing to do. If you love the game and you want to play at the top level making your debut here was one of the best days of my life.”

While his ambitions for himself and his players are characteristically high, there is an acceptance that the jump from youth football to first team, which he made at the age of 18, can be too big for some but the fact that the opportunity to take that step exists under Klopp gives Gerrard hope that others will follow Trent Alexander Arnold to Melwood. “I think a lot of them are shocked with step up to Melwood from

“I think a lot of them are shocked with step up to Melwood from the Academy,” he says. “I've seen a lot of players who have come out of the academy with huge reputations and go into the Melwood dressing room and then it is sink-or-swim and a lot of them sink. But there is a pathway there because we have a manager who will play them. He's given a lot of debuts this season and there are a lot more chances now than when I was in the team. There is a pathway but not for all of them so as well as competing together they are competing against themselves to get to Melwood and get that debut. Trent's going to be a beauty.”

Gerrard doesn’t say it but the development of Alexander-Arnold, an athletic, marauding midfielder who came into the first team at right back, is reminiscent of his own emergence. It also indicates that the 36-year-old has a keen eye for a player having identified his potential while still a Liverpool player. “He has all the attributes” Gerrard said of the teenager two years ago and his prediction looks increasingly well founded.

 

Now, though, Gerrard must show that he can harness talent as well as spotting it but while he admits he will “have to wait and see” what his strengths are as a coach, he is not intimidated by having to prove himself. “These nerves are excitement,” he says. “I feel confident I can do a good job and I am really looking forward to it. I am not scared nervous – I am excited nervous.”

 

https://www.joe.co.uk/sport/steven-gerrard-liverpool-manager-interview-tony-barrett-123415

He seems to be flexible, tactically:

 

Befitting his style as a player, Gerrard arrived in the role with a stripped-back, no-nonsense approach, looking to run the rule over his squad before making any big calls.

 

He gave a telling insight into his demands as a coach speaking with BT Sport in April, saying in order to make it as a senior professional “you have to be obsessed.”

 

“I love talent and I love seeing it, but at Liverpool’s academy, the important thing is they need to understand the other side of the game,” he explained.

 

“Fighting, winning, tackling. Going where it hurts, letting your lungs burns, really digging deep.”

 

He elaborated on this outlook later that month, vowing: “My teams will be physical.”

 

When he took the reins at Kirkby, he began with the basics, in a back-four system, alternating between a 4-4-2 diamond and a 4-2-3-1.

 

But in the absence of right-back options Neco Williams, Jordan Hunter and captain Liam Coyle of late, Gerrard has switched to a 3-4-3, which has prompted an excellent run of performances.

 

This has typically seen a three-man defence of Anthony Driscoll-Glennon, Tom Clayton and the impressive Rhys Williams, with Adam Lewis and Rafa Camacho his most accomplished wing-backs.

 

Switching formations has allowed Gerrard to retain a solid base, with the energy of Edvard Tagseth and the composure of Elijah Dixon-Bonner providing a welcome platform in midfield.

 

And the use of wing-backs has seen the young Reds improve in fluidity in the final third, with Curtis Jones shining in a free attacking role and Liam Millar in particular thriving up front.

 

It’s not about just getting his best players on the pitch, however: Gerrard has showcased a refined tactical nous in his first half-season, too.

 

This has been most notable with the U19s in the UEFA Youth League, of which he acknowledged in September, saying: “You play against different tactics, different formations—a different style.”

 

One clear example of this came in October’s 4-1 win away to Maribor, fielding high defensive line to counter the Slovenians’ long-ball approach.

 

And this was again shown in November’s 4-0 triumph at Sevilla, when Liverpool began with a high-intensity pressing game before sitting back and playing on the counter in order to frustrate an emotional opponent.

 

Appointing a youth coach of Gerrard’s reputation was a bold move by the Reds, risking an overawed dressing room, while his lack of experience could have proved an issue.

 

But with Critchley attesting in August that the 37-year-old had “thrown himself right into it,” these concerns were swiftly allayed.

 

And Gerrard’s impact on Liverpool’s U18s ranks is clear in his excellent man-management.

 

https://www.thisisanfield.com/2017/12/analysing-steven-gerrards-start-life-liverpool-u18s/

7 hours ago, ranger_syntax said:

 

A safe bet if you are betting on them to fail.

I feel the same about Gerard. 

 

 

1 hour ago, craig said:

I would take Gerrard before the vast majority of names we have heard.  For no other reason than he would actually excite the fanbase. 

 

Of all the names we have heard Warnock would be "safe" and a better bet.  MPH I would be interested in. 

 

Robbie Neilson ?  Alex Neil ?  Even FDB... No thanks, I would take the risk on Gerrard.

He would, but that doesn't mean he's going to be a success, or a fit. He's not done anything to suggest he'd be a good appointment. 

 

Warnock scares me, but he would be. I agree with MPH.

 

See, I would rather take the known risk of Neilson, Neil and FdB over the unknown risk of Gerard -- Although I'm not suggesting we approach any of those!  

1 hour ago, craig said:

There is also nothing to suggest that Steven Gerrard cannot be a better manager than every single one you have mentioned.  The only variable is that we haven't seen him manage a club yet.

 

It's all very well saying "what doe He bring" - but the reality that, as fans, we have little option but to trust the Board in asking those questions.  Nagelsmann is a non-starter, we know that.  The others would be no more a guarantee than Gerrard because they have never been involved in the British game.  You can't just take a philosophy from one country to another and expect it to work (or... you better believe in it AND have the patience to see it out...)

Surely the onus is on those Pro-Gerard posters to provide the evidence? 

 

I need to know what he'll bring before I can judge this potential appointment. I do have to trust the board on that matter, which I'll await. Until then I can only judge it on current evidence.

 

I'd rather take a known philosophy, even if it is untested in the UK, than no philosophy. Until I know what Gerard brings with regards to philosophy, I can't really judge, so prefer to err on the side of caution and scepticism. 

5 hours ago, ranger_syntax said:

An unknown quantity.

 

How common is it for someone to return to success in Europe after working in a retirement league?

I agree with you. 

 

I still see those names as a safer bet than Gerard, even if they are "working in a retirement league".

14 minutes ago, buster. said:

On the face of it, the "solid" names sound interesting but whether they could be attracted to Scottish football is debatable.

 

To me, Gerrard comes accross as a Liverpool version of Barry Ferguson, in that there is no disputing his qualities as a player but when I have listened to him, it has been less than inspiring/insightful, as countless footballing cliches are used.

ie. I don't think he'd be a great inspirational communicator.

 

However, in his favour, he does seem to have got his head down and made an effort to 'go modern' within the Liverpool football operation.

 

 

What evidence is there that he's "made an effort to 'go modern'"? 

 

Edit: Just seen your video -- I'll have a watch! Thanks.

 

I still don't know what he'd bring. He must be learning from Klopp, but has he been able to implement it with the U-18s? 

 

It's just a big question mark for me.

1 minute ago, ranger_syntax said:

Laudrup and Villas Boas have been in the Persian gulf and China most recently.

 

Not sure either is such a good idea.

And Gerard is?

 

What is your opinion on Gerard being our next manager?

22 minutes ago, buster. said:

I'd ask those who don't fancy a Gerrard appointment, who would their realistic choice be.....Yes, we need experience and pragmatism but from who ?

 

I'd prefer Clarke but don't think he'd take the job.

All things considered, I'm struggling to come up with what would be considered as a low risk, feasible and 'acceptable' option.

 

Hence, if it is to be Gerrard then we have to hope there is ample and appropriate support within his staff (especially scouting) and of course, financially. 

 

The support always follow the team and do their bit but they will also probably need to show more patience. 

Even if he gets financial and back-room support, it doesn't mean he'll be successful. I still don't know what He brings? How does he want to play the game, can he implement it? etc.

 

I don't necesarily want "experience and pragmatism".

 

For me, M. Laudurp, Villas-Boas (unattached) would be solid appointments; Basel's Raphael Wicky's been good; Hertha's Pal Dardai (Hoffenheim's Nagelsmann will be free in the summer, but is not an option); Benevento's De Zerbi is more of a left-field option. They all show tactical proficiency, but vary in terms of pragmatism and experience.

1 minute ago, Unicorn said:

Gerrard stopped Brendan Rodgers from winning the league once before, maybe he can do it again...

 

Just now, BEARGER said:

One thing in Gerrard’s Favour is he has already stopped Rodgers from winning a league.

 

 

You're too late with that one, guys.

 

You're just embarrassing yourselves!  

Just now, Uilleam said:

I think that players may be attracted to work with a 'name' manager/coach, who, otherwise, might  feel that there are better opportunities elsewhere. 

Can a high profile 'face' help with sourcing investment? That may remain to be seen, but it surely wouldn't hinder such an exercise. 

But just assembling a higher calibre squad, with more money, doesn't necessarily bring success. He needs to be able to manage and coach them into playing in a successful way. 

 

I'm sure players were desperate to play under Maradona too, but he was sh*te as a manager. 

3 minutes ago, DMAA said:

I'm undecided. It strikes me as stupid to play roulette again at such a crucial time in the club's history.

 

On the other hand Steven Gerrard is one of the biggest names in world football. You just can't argue that he would bring much needed positive attention to our club from around the globe. And crucially he could make a huge difference in persuading higher quality players to join. Playing under Steven Gerrard with the prospect of a run in Europe would be a huge draw to players all over the world.

 

 

 

 

That may be true, but what does he bring to get results? It has to more than just bring in good players and press. 

3 minutes ago, JohnMc said:

To be fair he is the last guy that stopped Brendan Rogers winning the league.

5 minutes ago, Uilleam said:

No; I think, well, I hope, that the attempt to bring in a name known around the globe may be part of a longer game. 

 

Of course, it may just be a chat on the golf course, or at the 19th hole ("I could sort out your team; I mean, Scottish League, how hard could it be?") which has grown arms, legs, and everything else. 

I don't think a marquee signing brings anything, at least wrt the football operation.

 

True. 

4 minutes ago, buster. said:

If you want to build something you start with a good foundation and it's the football operation as a whole that has to brought up to as high a level as possible, as quickly as possible. Then, you have to have a first team set-up that takes full advantage.

 

It's about getting value for money for every pound spent and adding value via improving footballers of all ages.

 

If you can get as close to this as possible, you may have a better chance of on-field succes at home and abroad.

Of course, but that doesn't contradict anything I've said. In fact, you've emphasised my point. 

2 minutes ago, DMAA said:

Maybe he's demonstrated this at the level he's at?

Perhaps. I admitted as much on the other thread. I wish I knew more about his style, and what he could bring. I've not seen/read anything to suggest what it might be. 

6 minutes ago, Uilleam said:

Do you think that, maybe, the pursuit of a 'marquee' name has behind it a rationale beyond exciting the long suffering support, and encouraging them to invest in season tickets?

 

 

 

Most probably. Short-termism in a nut-shell.

 

What's worrying is many see this as a good move, simply because of that marquee name. It just doesn't follow for me. 

1 minute ago, SteveC said:

If you are looking for someone who can "do anything in Europe" then you are limiting the search to..........no-one. It's the SPL we play in.  Europe's long gone unless the whole make-up of European football changes.    Getting through the qualifying rounds is now going to get as rare as reaching finals used to be and will probably get harder with each successive change to the rules.  The Europa league's champ's league place means that big clubs are starting to take it seriously a couple of rounds earlier than they used to do though there is always the chance - if we could ever get past the qualifiers - of meeting a few teams who play their reserves/try to lose to get out of the tournament in the opening rounds.

 

No, we play in the SPFL Premiership!  

 

I understand it's not a priority, but I don't see why there can't be a manager that can do the job now, while also bring something, build something, that will see us progress in Europe. 'Progress' is relative; it doesn't mean Qualifying for the CL Last-16, merely being able to take on European sides without reverting to ultra-defensive, counter-attacking football; maybe go on a run in the Europa League. 

I'm No! No! A Thousand Times No!!, but then I'm not in the camp that state we need experience and pragmatism. 

 

I want a modern, tactical coach -- young or experienced -- which they have to have demonstrated in their work.

 

I'll get behind him, whoever it is, though.

 

2 minutes ago, Uilleam said:

i can see a lot of similarities, frankly, not least the "wow" factor of both. 

 

I believe that he is a Liverpool fan.  I am told, for what it is worth, and for all that it matters,  that he is not a roman catholic. 

He does have a daughter called Lourdes, it seems, but, since we are currently in need of a miracle......

Steven Gerard, a "Liverpool fan"? I think you might be on to something...