Crimson Dynamo

Itâ??s a strange oneâ?¦. As the original post states, the fact we are willing to possibly negotiate titles away suggests or implies guilt. It could also just be we are desperate to the point where we will just say f**k it. However I still donâ??t think David Murray would be that stupid. I get the tax avoidance thing everybody seems to be doing that in some form or another and not just in Football. Comedians, politicians, and pop stars. Everybody seems to be at it hardly a day goes by where you donâ??t read something But apparently for us to play in the SPL each season we had to deliver audited accounts. These accounts as I understand contained the EBT scheme. â?¢ What did the SFA/SPL do with them? â?¢ Did they even read them? â?¢ If they did why are they suddenly a problem? â?¢ If they didnâ??t why didnâ??t they read them? â?¢ Did they question the EBT scheme? â?¢ When HMRC decided to say they were illegal. Did the SFA/SPL say by the way Rangers we need to talk? The list could go onâ?¦.. I am not exonerating David Murray from his other stuff. I hope the authorities ask him some serious questions after this for the state he has allowed us to get into.

I completely agree. I just don't think Rangers should base any defence on saying that sort of thing. I think we should sort our own problems out first then challenge the SFA to hold everybody else to the same standards. If they don't then we should sue them into oblivion as it would show blatant bias.

Does it really matter if Celtic did it for 1 season? To be honest I am more concerned about what is happening to Rangers at the moment. Rangers need to sort themselves out first and foremost. Once we have done that then we can hold all these people to the same standard that they have held us too. But only then...

He's an attention seeking fantasist. According to the rubbish he's spouting the problems at Rangers were just a simple mix up of company names. Come on Really? Anybody that challenges his views on twitter or questions his theories. He either ignores them or tells them to fxxx off! If it is as simple as he's saying then why did poor Craig not see this and fix it eg move the money from the wrong company to the right one.

I would take Kyle and Beattie. Would like to see Hemmings get a chance though. We should build for the future. I don't like the crazy talk of Mols, Albert and Ferguson. We would gain nothing by having them. Novo could probably still do a job at that level. But has he still got it? Done next to nothing last couple of seasons

For me in my lifetime there has been so many great teams: 80's Juventus & Mid 90's Juventus 80's & early 90's Milan 91 Red Star Belgrade Mid 90's Ajax Current Barcelona Early 00's Real Madrid

If true would this then mean. Charles Green will be sueing Duff and Phelps?

from Daily Record http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/football/spl/rangers/2012/07/14/ibrox-chief-charles-green-told-purchase-of-players-contracts-is-not-legal-86908-23908316/ Ibrox chief Charles Green told purchase of players contracts is 'not legal' Jul 14 2012 By Alan Marshall CHARLES GREEN faces a fresh blow in his battle to hold on to Rangers’ players as his purchase of their contracts is not valid, says an expert on employment law. The newco boss says his £5.5m purchase of assets included £2.75m to buy player contracts and registrations. But Adrian Hoggarth, head of employment law at top London firm Prolegal, believes the deal struck may have been outside of the law. He said: “It is not legally possible for Rangers and Charles Green to buy and sell players as part of a business transfer. “Whether or not the players transferred in this case appears to depend on two things. “Firstly, were they assigned to the business of the football club when it transferred? This is a matter of law and has nothing to do with any money that may have changed hands. “Secondly, were the players aware of the transfer at the time it took place? Case law suggests that if you know about a transfer before it happens and don’t object to it, you lose the right to object once the business transfers. “To suggest otherwise would take away the right of an employee to object to being transferred, which is a right enshrined in law.”

People are laughing and yesterday, when Sky cut away from live coverage of the SFL's media conference after the vote to cover John Terry's exit from a court in London, we were put in our place. Clearly Sky believe one English player is much more important than anything that happened on one of the most historic days in Scottish football's history. This shows why Scottish Football should not be running cap in hand to SKY anymore. TV Money is slowly but surely killing our game

I think we need to get behind Charles Green now. He is the only 1 who stumped up any money. I couldn't care less if he is only in this to make money. He has been open and honest about that. McCann said the same when took over at Celtic and when he left he them with a fairly successful business model. John Brown while I loved him as a player and yes he is a Rangers man. He really isn't helping at the moment. He is dividing the support at a time when we should be more united than ever. Walter Smith, McColl and co all walked when the saw Charles Greens' plans which suggests to me they must hold up. Otherwise why did they walk? I will say Charles Green could do with being a bit more open about certain things. i.e. the issues with season tickets

http://www.studiolegaleinternazionale.com/blogHome2.php?blogPage=1&blogDate=2012-07-08+16%3A38%3A32 LETTER FROM GIOVANNI DI STEFANO TO F.A. CHAIRMAN RE RANGERS FOOTBALL CLUB 8 July 2012: Mr. David Bernstein Chairman of the FA Wembley Stadium PO Box 1966 London SW1P 9EQ Fax +448449808201 Cc Alex Horne General Secretary 8th July 2012 Dear David THE RANGERS FOOTBALL CLUB, IBROX, GLASGOW I have the honour to write with regard to the above which as you are aware has attracted considerable attention and also a Parliamentary Enquiry by the Culture and Media Select Committee this week. As you are also aware there is an on-going Strathclyde Police investigation into the 2011 acquisition of ‘the company’ The Rangers Football Club PLC and as such I make no comment on that issue. The position at present as you are aware is that The Rangers Football Club PLC is in administration and not in liquidation. That is a factual matter that can be confirmed at Companies House. The Receivers appointed in effect ‘sold’ the assets to Sevco 5088 Ltd but the SPL Ltd refused to transfer the share held by The Rangers Football Club PLC to Sevco 5088 Ltd. The position is now that in essence Sevco 5088 Ltd has applied to the SFL who as we understand at the time of writing will admit what we will call the ‘new’ Rangers Football Club into their Division 1 without sanctions. That is of course a matter that will require affirmation on Friday 13th July 2012. That of course leaves The Rangers Football Club PLC still an ‘active’ company albeit de jure in administration. According to research carried by a supporter of Rangers Football Club the club was per se admitted to the English FA in a special sitting in 1885 and I note that the English FA was already in its incorporated form since 26th October 1863. Below is an extract from a newspaper that the avid researcher has found: (see twitter http://twitter.com/DEVILSADVOKAT/) Further in 1886/1887 The Rangers Football Club played in the English FA Cup and we attach the results from the various rounds. (see attached photo) The Rangers Football Club was founded in 1872 and did not become an incorporated body until 1899 when The Rangers Football Club Ltd was de jure founded. There is a submission as to whether or not that incorporation was lawfully valid but for the purposes of this letter it is not important. What is important is that in 1885 The Rangers Football Club (the non-incorporated body) certainly became a member of the English FA and according to the resolution passed by the FA was a moment of great pride. The words used were “They are the only Scotch Club who have been honoured.” We thus know that the club referred to is indeed The Rangers Football Club and not any namesake. The Football Association became a Limited Liability Company on the 23rd June 1903 under company registration number 00077797. I understand in fact that Ian Fleming who enjoyed football so much used the 007 numbers from the certificate of incorporation for his fictional character James Bond. What is however, unclear is what happened to the membership of The Rangers Football Club. The Football Association was incorporated in 1903 and The Rangers Football Club in 1899. Having researched the rules and regulations of the period and of course the Articles of Association of both FA and RFC I find nothing in them which would sustain anything other than Rangers Football Club Ltd inheriting the right to play in the English league. I could find nothing that suggested that the Rangers Football Club lost their right or were expelled from the FA after incorporation. As a consequence the position is that although The Rangers Football Club PLC may be in administration and although the ‘assets’ of that company may have been sold to Savco 5088 Ltd the contract of sale between the Receivers appointed and Savco 5088 Ltd did not include ‘the right to participate in the English FA league.’ As I understand matters The Rangers Football Club PLC has a contingent liability to HMRC and other related liabilities to trade creditors which at a meeting under the Creditors Voluntary Arrangement were rejected principally by HMRC. If I am correct in the assertion that Rangers Football Club has never lost the right to play in the English League then since The Rangers Football Club PLC is still only in administration and with contingent liabilities namely the bulk of which are subject to lengthy legal process (the trade debts are minimal) would make the club an attractive prospect to acquire and certainly I and others may well take a specific interest in advancing matters. Since the English League does not start for some time I can confirm that subject to your response on this vital issue there is a prospective party from the Middle East who may well acquire the shares of The Rangers Football Club PLC (in administration) and accept all the contingent liabilities if the club is still de facto entitle, as it would appear it is, to play in the English FA League since there is no evidence to the contrary. I look forward to hearing from you and remain as ever Yours sincerely GIOVANNI DI STEFANO CLICK TO DOWNLOAD PDF LETTER

It's a strange one. Going by his letter he says Rangers played in the FA Cup (which I knew anyway) but so did the likes of Queens Park (The only Scottish club to reach the final) does that mean they were members of the FA aswell? Going by most things i've read it says that they were just invited. I'd presume Rangers were in a similar situation and that the membership was honourary rather than official. It would be fantastic though if it was more than that and could offer the escape route we have all been looking for....... from wikipedia. he Football Association Challenge Cup, commonly known as the FA Cup, is a knockout competition in English association football. It is the oldest football competition in the world, having commenced in 1871. Although the Cup is organised by The Football Association, the governing body of the sport in England, and is open only to clubs playing in FA-affiliated leagues in the modern era, all of which are based in England, a number of teams from Scotland have also entered, primarily in the competition's early years. The first Scottish club to enter was Queen's Park, who accepted an invitation to take part in the very first competition after a number of the clubs which had originally entered withdrew. The Glasgow team were by far the dominant force in Scottish football, and no other team had even managed to score a goal against them. Because of a combination of byes and the withdrawal of opponents, "Queen's" reached the semi-finals without playing a match, but after holding Wanderers to a draw the Scottish club was forced to withdraw as the funds could not be raised to return for a replay.The following season Queen's entered the competition again and, to ease the travelling expenses required to take part in a competition in which virtually every other team was based in the home counties, were afforded byes all the way to the semi-finals. At this stage the club was drawn against Oxford University, whereupon the Scots withdrew from the competition, although one account states that Queen's in fact beat Oxford only to then withdraw as the team could not afford to travel to London for the final.In 1873, the newly-formed Scottish Football Association launched the Scottish Cup, but Queen's Park continued to enter the FA Cup draw, although for unknown reasons the club withdrew each time without playing. In 1883, Queen's returned to the FA Cup and reached the final, scoring resounding wins over Crewe Alexandra (10–0) and Manchester F.C. (15–0) en route, only to be defeated by Blackburn Rovers. The match against Manchester was the first FA Cup tie to be staged in Scotland, hosted at Titwood, the home of Clydesdale CC. A year later Queens met Blackburn Rovers in the final once again, with the English team again emerging victorious. The 1885–86 competition saw the first participation by other Scottish clubs, as Queen's were joined by Partick Thistle, Third Lanark, Rangers and Heart of Midlothian, although the latter two withdrew without playing a match. These clubs all returned for the 1886–87 competition, along with newcomers Renton and Cowlairs. In 1887, the Scottish Football Association banned its members from taking any further part in the FA Cup.[17] No more Scottish clubs participated until Gretna F.C. entered the competition in the 1980s. Because the town of Gretna is located extremely close to the border, the local football club had opted to play in the English football league system and by the 1980s had reached the Northern Premier League,[18] making the team eligible to enter the FA Cup. Gretna played in the qualifying rounds of the FA Cup for nineteen seasons, making the first round proper twice, until the club joined the Scottish Football League in 2002. Performance of Scottish clubs by season Season Club Round reached Notes Ref 1871–72 Queen's Park Semi-finals Reached the semi-finals without playing a match, held Wanderers to a draw, but withdrew rather than play a replay 1872–73 Queen's Park Semi-finals Received byes to the semi-finals but either withdrew immediately or beat Oxford University and then withdrew 1876–77 Queen's Park 3rd round Received byes to 3rd round but then withdrew 1879–80 Queen's Park 1st round Withdrew without playing a match 1880–81 Queen's Park 1st round Withdrew without playing a match 1881–82 Queen's Park 1st round Withdrew without playing a match 1882–83 Queen's Park 1st round Withdrew without playing a match 1883–84 Queen's Park Final Defeated in the final by Blackburn Rovers 1884–85 Queen's Park Final Defeated in the final by Blackburn Rovers 1885–86 Queen's Park 2nd round Reached 2nd round but withdrew 1885–86 Third Lanark 2nd round Reached 2nd round but then withdrew 1885–86 Partick Thistle 1st round 1885–86 Heart of Midlothian 1st round Withdrew without playing a match 1885–86 Rangers 1st round Withdrew without playing a match 1886–87 Rangers Semi-finals 1886–87 Partick Thistle 5th round 1886–87 Cowlairs 3rd round 1886–87 Renton 3rd round Defeated holders Blackburn Rovers in 2nd round 1886–87 Third Lanark 2nd round 1886–87 Heart of Midlothian 1st round 1886–87 Queen's Park 1st round 1983–84 Gretna 2nd qualifying round 1984–85 Gretna 3rd qualifying round 1985–86 Gretna 3rd qualifying round 1986–87 Gretna 4th qualifying round 1987–88 Gretna 2nd qualifying round 1988–89 Gretna 2nd qualifying round 1989–90 Gretna 1st qualifying round 1990–91 Gretna 3rd qualifying round 1991–92 Gretna 1st round 1992–93 Gretna 1st qualifying round 1993–94 Gretna 1st round The most recent appearance of a Scottish team in the FA Cup proper 1994–95 Gretna 1st qualifying round 1995–96 Gretna Preliminary round 1996–97 Gretna 1st qualifying round 1997–98 Gretna 3rd qualifying round 1998–99 Gretna 1st qualifying round 1999–00 Gretna 2nd qualifying round 2000–01 Gretna Preliminary round 2001–02 Gretna 2nd qualifying round 2002–03 Gretna 1st qualifying round Withdrew without playing a match

Taken from http://www.idea.gov.uk/idk/core/page.do?pageId=6908271 Although TUPE does not impose a specific time scale for consultation, they must be meaningful and allow sufficient time for the representatives to consider the proposals. It also states: An employment tribunal may award 'appropriate compensation' if an employer fails to provide the required information or to undertake meaningful consultation. The failure of the transferor does not automatically transfer to the transferee. They are jointly and severally liable. In practice, this means that any award will be made against the employer who failed to meet its obligations. I would say that there is a fair chance no meaningful consultation took place

I personally wouldn't like Barry Ferguson to come back. I still don't like his role in the whole PLG thing, I don't think his actions were very becoming of a Rangers captain. Who knows had Murray backed PLG then our youth team could've been alot better. I like most of the rumours floating about re: Black and Beattie. Both of those could do a job. So could probably someone like Gavin Rae especially in the 3rd division. But I would much prefer to see young players finally given a chance at Rangers. This is the time for a long term solution. No more quick fixes!

Were the contracts not going to transfer on the 1st July? Green had said he was going to have a sit down with the players on Thursday 28th June. But the players started announcing decisions on or around the 24th June. Also under TUPE legislations do they not need to give you a 90 day consultation period? Having gone through a number of these recently myself it was always that or around that amount of time. Except the last time which was a month. It seems though Green wanted to do it in 3 days not sure of the legalities in that.

At least he has stopped writing sentences in CAPITALS!!!!!!!!

We can sign anybody. We just can't register them with the Leagues. I think Beattie would be a good signing he seems to fairly consistently score goals but has just never quite made it big. When he was at Celtic he had Larsson and co ahead of him so that is understandable. No idea why he hasn't really made it at the other clubs I hope tho the rumours about Barry Ferguson are just that. I think he would be a backward step at this time.

John Brown thinks he is doing the right for Rangers. I’m convinced of that and by the actions of a large number of Rangers fans they do too. But, the “starve them out”. Says to me that if John Brown does have financial backing then his financial backers aren’t willing to put in anymore money than what has been offered. This is why they are saying we should boycott buying season tickets to “panic” Charles Green and co into selling. But in reality I don’t think Charles Green could care less if Rangers fans buy season tickets. If they don’t and newco Rangers fails then he knows he can make his money another way. I don’t think he wants that. But if it did happen he could then say he tried I just never got any backing from fans etc.

The SFA needs to start working to their own agenda and stop pandering to others if they want to save Scottish Football. If they don't it will die. Just a thought could this be what Celtic want? If Scottish Football goes to the wall they could make a strong case to gain admission to another league ie England

He never justified the large price tag in my opinion. Just another that Rangers wasted money on.

Read that earlier. Interesting conclusions. If true. DiSTefano is king of the smallprint and loopholes

Not just sporting integrity you forgot moral integrity as well ;-)

The thing with Aitken before it. I still remember it, might even have been John Brown he tussled with but it went out for a throw. It was a Rangers throw. But Aitken picked it up and took it and it led to the goal. That really annoyed me as a 9 year old watching it!!!!!!

He spoke with a lot of heart. But it raises more and more questions. Biggest one being where have they been since February 14th? Crazy situation all round.

If it was his plan to buy the assets and sell them. Then rather than the pretence of CVA's and Newcos Surely it would be easier for him to just do that. He would then just be the guy that bought the assets. The fans anger would be directed towards Craig Whyte and David Murray for allowing us to get to that stage. For what it's worth I think he's probably genuine enough I just don't think he has any real financial backing because of the uncertainty over the players and which league we're going to be playing in