amms

With respect that hardly addresses the point, no one is arguing they are breaking the law. Do you think any political chanting is acceptable at Ibrox and would you defend it? Quite, and if there were no other meaningful ways of countering it, of expressing opposition to it then I'd understand. But frankly sining about it at the football is just posturing.

Thanks for your reply. As you say yourself it is difficult to define what is 'decent', that too is very subjective. I'm not even sure what 'decent' means in this context. That's an interesting line. Surely that's what the Union Bears guys are doing, they are forcing their views on to me and everyone else at Ibrox. I'm not saying they can't hold those views, I'm not saying they have to change their views, I'm not even saying I disagree with their views I'm just saying it isn't an appropriate place for them to air them. I'm not dictating my views, quite the opposite surely. For what it's worth I stopped attending Scotland matches for that very reason.

Hang on, that can't be right. Celtic won the other night, quite comfortably from what I understand. I was listening to Radio Scotland last night on the way home, it was the proudest moment of Lennon's career they said, it proved his excellence as a manager and restored Scottish pride, I assumed they'd won by 2 or 3 goals. Even the Tims I work with were raving about their performance. This is clearly anti-Celtic propaganda from UEFA, based in Switzerland you know, plenty of Proddies there. Say no more.

This is great, thanks to everyone who was involved in making it happen. I've always been unsure about the economic sustainability of a Rangers museum however it would still be something wonderful to see. As an aside if anyone hasn't done the Gallant Pioneers bus tour I'd urge them to consider it, I took my dad for us birthday a couple of summers ago and it was really good, educational and great value.

So where's the line mate? Are everyone's politics acceptable, should we live with any chants or songs that are political in nature? Currently the issue troubling the Unionist/Loyalist politicians of Northern ireland is abortion, if a section of our support start a pro-life chant do you think that's okay? Or how about creationism, another favourite subject with some NI Unionist politicians, is a blast of 'you can stick your evolution up your arse' from the stands one we should turn a deaf ear too? What if some fancy a bit of BNP political chanting is that still cool, would you still suggest we live with it? Is Marxism okay, anarchism, what about anti or pro EU? Who is the arbiter of taste and decency here, who decides what's OK, if one groups 'politics' are acceptable to be sung are everyones?

They're a narcissistic bunch aren't they. Can't knock them for the money raised or the player sponsorship though, fair play.

Just in case you missed it Ajax beat Man City in the Champions League tonight, their starting 11 cost a combined total of €4.4 million (about £3.5 mil) and seven players came through their academy. Ajax are still a long way off winning the tournament again I think but they seem to be going in the correct direction. We should take note.

It wasn't 'my point of view' it was a question, the curly thing with the dot under it at the end is the give-away. There was no point of view expressed there was a question asked which you quoted but didn't answer. Absolute rubbish! Any inference is deeply embedded in your head not anywhere else. You seem to disagree with me, am I to infer from that you are offended? Of course not because the two are simply not analogous. Your choice of language is curious, they clearly don't "merely disagree" they obviously strongly disagree, even fundamentally disagree, none of those suggest offence though. But by using words like 'offended' and 'whimsy' and 'merely' you play down and misrepresent what is clearly not a whim but a strongly held viewpoint or a matter of principle. There is nothing sensible about your conclusion. Your welcome.

Well you quoted my question in your post. No, you accused me of it I was sending it right back to you. Bollocks it's semantics, they are two words with very different meanings. Whimsical and offended are your words, there is nothing whimsical about this. It's an interesting choice of words to describe people who disagree with the appropriateness of certain chants and infers a frivolousness and that's neither fair nor accurate. Only you know why you chose them. Yeah, well done.

I'm point scoring? Pot, kettle, mate! At least GovanAllan answered the question, you just deflect it. To answer your question my 'entire behaviour' isn't dictated by anyone, I've not left Gersnet, as a 'super mod' I thought you might have realised that. You used the word 'offended', I didn't, I said 'disagree', there is a big difference. I don't think they are 'offended' I think they disagree with the sentiment expressed and the appropriateness of the venue for expressing it. But hey, we're point scoring now so why bother.

This thread is quite a jaw dropper. After all the tribulations of the past year we still have an apparently large section of our support who would rather active, lifelong Rangers supporters walked away from the club than they had to modify their songbook for 90 minutes once a week. Not change their political views, not change how they vote or what they believe in, just what they chant at a football match. That's too much to expect apparently. It's been mentioned often since we went into administration about our apparent lack of influential 'friends', people who could have done or said something to help us. Bluemazza made a great post a page or two back about Alex Thomson and his current aim of exposing a 'Rangers criminal underclass' whatever the fuck that is. Well he's got an hour of primetime five nights a week and resources to put into this quest. Yet here we are, 31 pages of slagging, accusing, counter accusing and belittling each other, all because a minority of our support insist on chanting obscene and offensive slogans at home to Queens Park. Yeah, what an atmosphere they've helped to create. It seems the 'no one likes us we don't care' mentality remains as strong as ever in some. But now it isn't just restricted to opposition fans it seems our own are fair game too. Like it or not, and I don't as it happens, 45% of the vote at the last election went to the SNP, it stands to reason that a lot of them were Rangers supporters. Should they all 'fuck off'? Supporting Rangers shouldn't be predicated on being a Unionist, on being Protestant, on being a capitalist or a Maoist or a Jedi fuckin Knight. I asked a question on post #200 about 10 pages ago on this thread which as yet those defending the Union Bears chants haven't answered, so I'll try again. Where's the line guys, politically what shouldn't we allow to be chanted, what won't we accept and who decides that? Does anything go, seriously? The determination of some in our support to alienate as many people as possible never ceases to amaze me, to the point where you begin to actually question their motives.

With freedom of speech comes responsibility. To suggest you have ever been able to say what you want when you want is total nonsense.

Not my words but those of ex-Ger and current Ajax boss Frank De Boer. Interesting article from the BBC website on the current philosophy at Ajax, worth five minutes of your time. A possible future for us perhaps? http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/19985608

So is that a 'no, I don't think they should stop'?

But that's not what happened, I keep telling you that, you don't know what happened yet you still say some isn't a Rangers fan because of something you don't know anything about and when called on it instead of withdrawing it and admitting you don't know enough about it you keep trying to justify it. So yes, you passed judgement on a public forum, and if you didn't mean or don't think it matters then you should withdraw it.

I'm too old to even understand what that chant means. But as long as I've been going to the football the 'younger' element of the support have song anti-police songs, it's kind of a right of passage surely. Back in my day a rendition of 'if you hate the Glasgow polis clap your hands' was always on the songsheet in the East Enclosure. I'm not defending it but most of them will grow out of it.

You don't think it's a question that deserves an answer then? Just mockery.

Why? Shouldn't you be ignoring me then? I am interested in what you say, I'm open to other points of view. I'm just pointing out you did exactly what you criticised someone else for, name calling should be avoided. Whatever justification Gazza_8 feels he shouldn't have used the word 'scum' but you can hardly pull him up for it when you then go and do the same a paragraph later.

@Bear_ and the others who 'support' the political chants, genuine question. Now that you know that a section of the Rangers support disagree with the chants, some to such a degree that they'd actually stop attending Ibrox because of them, do you still think it's okay to sing them and will you continue to do so? Would you rather turn people away from going to support their team then temper your choice of songs?

Right, so pull someone up for using 'scum' then call others 'sanctimonious twats'. Aye, you're doing well GA, no hypocrisy there...

Here's the thing, I've not passed judgement on any other Rangers supporter it was you that did that and you did it with knowing any of the facts or reasons. So yes, you get to express an opinion, and I get to call you on it and tell you it's bullshit. You're the guy who thinks they can tell people they aren't real Rangers fans yet I'm the pompous one, you don't do irony clearly.

Interesting. So Ally can sack Charles Green, not the other way round.

"A Rangers criminal underclass" that's just an astonishing statement. Are they directly connected to the club then, are they actively employed by Rangers, given instruction by Ally and Charles Green from their layer in what crimes to carry out and do they share their bags of swag with the club? Underclass is such a loaded word, it is of course a code word used by amongst others David Duke the Grand Wizard of the Klu Klux Klan to signify poor blacks and by various right wing politicians to dismiss those who are at the bottom of the social ladder. That man is a disgrace, I'm just stunned at the language he uses.

Bollocks it does, you don't get to decide who is and who isn't a Rangers fan, thank fuck. You've no idea what you are writing about, unfortunately it doesn't stop you posting.

Whittaker was (is?) teetotal and was present also, it might be him people are confusing with Brown. The story I heard about that night was that Brown was indulging in a drunken sing-song with McGregor and Ferguson and that some of the songs were not the type you expect the captain of Celtic to sing!!