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That's because I am an angry old man. (Not) sorry if you have an issue with that. And stop exaggerating, it's more like 95%.

I understand some want to give up on Clement, but the replacements being quoted are horrible. Clement and the board must have an agrrement about his future or he would have walked himself after the suffering the same lack of backing SG did. We must stay the course to benefit from the money to be made from Europe and player trading. It would not just be Clement we would have to replace, it would be all his staff and probably Koppen too.

But that could also taint that new manager with this season, rather than starting fresh. Also allows the 'new manager bump' to start at the beginning of the new season, rather that fizzle out at the start of the season as has happened with the last two

And when a manager does play one of the youths and the result goes against us, there's calls for his resignation. We're an impatient support that doesn't seem to allow managers to play youths and risk bad results. Managers are risking their jobs by doing it.

Couldn't agree more. The 'rip it up and start again' model usually ends in disaster. If this board was Man City most would want Pep sacked.

George Graham taking bungs in recruitment. A real dream team.

Gerrard's stock has fallen two fold because of where he left Villa in the league with Unai Emery picking up with the same squad and reaching the European places. But secondly to fail in Saudi where the term open cheque book goes to a new level. Gerrard needs Rangers more than Rangers need Gerrard at this point in time. There has been a pattern with the current manager and the previous two that all have started well but its fizzled out big time - although I think Gio just went on a bad run and could have turned it around. Like Clement I think Gio may have been just a bit "too nice" at times whilst Beale was just arrogant. This conversation may develop hugely if we have a negative result at Tynecastle this weekend.

Nothing new in it that we didn't know.

Style is critical to the whole thing though. It’s much more important than simply signing a mix of young, experienced etc. My understanding of this kind of thing is that for each position we have types of player with certain attributes that we sign to fit a pre-defined system. A player with attributes x, y and z has a very high likelihood of succeeding in our chosen system and we recruit accordingly. For example, I think we should be targeting centre backs who are aggressive and dominate in aerial and ground duels primarily. Have we ever had a success at centre back who didn’t tick those boxes? Propper’s stats clearly showed he wasn’t those things. The wide forward positions should be either goalscorers or creators/dribblers or ideally both, and left footed for the right wing and right for the left. Cerny fits this but we have a very low chance of keeping him. Our major permanent signing in this position was a very weird profile. No real outstanding strengths. Mediocre across the board and almost rock bottom statistically defensively, aerially and physically. It’s just a bizarre style of player to spend so much on for the position. If you consider him a 10, the same point applies. I could go on to other positions but you get the idea.

"[Nils Koppen] clarified that this would mean we recruit towards a club blueprint of player and playing style, and not towards the style of any given coach or manager."

Ive not mentioned other sports. For me in the 90s Stephen Hendry was a Hero of mine - Before the days most tournaments were on TV I used to sit up late and watch his scores on Teletext. Still the greatest for me - unplayable in the 90s.

I agree. It's not about getting 'top tier', it's about getting a decent coach. It's a similar view to those saying we can't afford to replace Bassey because we sold him for £20m. He cost nothing.

Are some fans honestly saying that for £2M a year, we can't entice / find a coach who can beat Ross County, Killie, Motherwell on a regular basis? Wow.......

Caught up in our grumpy mood ( 😱😜 ) you probably missed the point of the sentence ... IMHO, we need someone who understands the task at hand, i.e. Scottish league titles. Be that Muscat or someone else. Hence, there should be Scots involved at some point, McCann, Weir or the like. These two were just examples of people who know what makes our hearts tick. What is necessary for Rangers FC, as it runs through their veins. We don't need either of the Scottish guys mentioned as managers, but as people who tell the guy at the helm about the direction the ship must sail.

Not playing this week.

Couldn't afford his wages, or the job he did at Celtic was supported by 40 odd million on transfers. I doubt we will have £4 million to spend in the summer barring a lottery win.

It could achieve a chance for a new person to come in and assess the current playing staff in preparation for a full pre season. Non of the above. If we dont have even an unofficial shortlist under current circumstances then there is something wrong. Souness with a young assistant? If he is a DMW then what are we waiting for - However as fans we know he will get the Europa league.

50% for the second night in a row. 3 out 4 ties in the balance but that has to be Celtic out now.

Managers : I believe any discussion on recent managers (which also crosses over to the board, more of that later), has to start with a champagne soaked SG being interviewed when we were presented with the SPL trophy. Sitting with Emma Dodds, a delighted SG told us all that we'd "fix the roof when the sun was shining" and had assurances from the board that he'd be able to replace / address the areas he thought required strengthening. That didn't happen. What SG had done was install the standards. He had found a way to beat Celtic and finally, found a way to defeat the rest. All whilst reestablishing our reputation in Europe. When he took over, we were an utter shambles yet he got us challenging at home and abroad. Yes we could have and should have won more trophies, but he won the one that really, really mattered. We then fell short against Malmo and SG was already hinting at not being backed as he was promised he would be. When he left, we were top of the league and had beaten Celtic (again) 1-0 at Ibrox with a covid-ravaged squad. I think most of us welcomed GVB - an ex-player who had had success as a manager. Somehow he managed to lose the lead in the SPL and the thrashings at the hands of Celtic we all thought were behind us suddenly returned. However, the run to EL Final was amazing and we defeated high standard teams and should have won the final. In retrospect, it could be argued that we sacked GvB prematurely. The appointment of Beale was a lazy appointment by the board (and I said so at the time). It lacked imagination and after a good start, we went into free fall and the inevitable happened. When Clement was appointed, I could see why the board chose him, but there were questions around the appointment. Fans from previous teams he'd managed spoke of a coach who struggled to break blocks and to change games. We also heard that the footballing people/ person the board asked for advice, didn't chose Clement as their 1st choice. Clements era stared brilliantly and we managed to find ourselves ahead in the race for the title. Then we lost to Motherwell at home (he changed the way our full backs played around that time), then we regressed and the rest is history. The capitulation was horrific and the signs we couldn't beat teams who played a certain way, or changed the way they played. Clement couldn't react with changes of his own. This preseason had alarm bells ringing (just like Beales) but most chose to ignore them. 1st game of the season we drew with Hearts at Tynecastle and that performance set the tone for domestic away games. We lost the CL qualifier and most blamed the wrongly dismissal of Jefte, but if we're honest with ourselves, we never looked like winning. Going into the season playing at Hampden and only having 1 fit forward didn't help. Neither did the managers reluctance to start his new signings. Our away form went from bad to worse and even after beating Celtic 3-0, we still found ourselves 13 points behind. We were unlucky not to win the LC, did well to get to last 8 of EL, then Sunday happened. There are far more "negatives" to Clements tenure than there are positives and previous managers have been sacked for less. If I remember correctly we've not beaten Celtic at Parkhead since Goldson scored 2 goals during 55. The defence's I hear for keeping Clement are; we can't afford to sack him and / or; we can't sack managers every year. It appears standards, quality and results have been replaced by acceptance of mediocrity. The Board I don't think there is a Rangers fan who didn't welcome the new area for our wheelchair supporters and this was long overdue. However, the previous major project, NEH, ran over timescale and budget, is to small, and it appears no lessons were learned from that project. It remains an under-utilised venue and cost over £11M. Money that was required in other areas. Whilst the financial repercussions of the Copland not being ready hurt, the fact that the board chose to deny there were any issues and lied to supporters right made a dire situation even worse. Not to mind we said, there will be contingencies in place right? Eh, no.......... One positive you didn't mention is the merchandise agreement with Castore. Bisgrove got us a great deal there and despite teething issues, we now have a deal that gives us substantial investment. However, it would be remiss not to mention the botched merchandise deals that we were still paying for until recently. Bisgrove was then promoted to a role he was unsuited for (another lazy appointment), promptly left and was (wrongly) thrown under the bus by the board for the Copland debacle. Well, they had to blame someone, the big boy that did it and ran away as they say. A critique of the board wouldn't be complete without a mention of the sale of part of The Albion. A horrendously short-term decision that went largely under the radar. It's also worth reiterating that the level of debt we currently face is solely down to this boards mistakes. They can't blame anyone, for this there is no big boy who done it and ran away. Its ALL on them - if taking us to the brink, to a place where we can't operate, where we can't sack a clearly struggling and out of touch manager, makes them the best board we've had this century, then they certainly are.

On the criticism the board are currently getting. How many of us thought Clement was a poor appointment when he was announced? How many of us thought Beale was a poor appointment when he was announced? What about Gio? I was quite pleased when GvB was announced as Gerrard's successor. As disappointed as I was when Gerrard left I thought the club had found an able replacement. He'd a connection to the club, had won a title in Holland and started pretty well when he first joined. The games the led to Seville will last a long, long time in the memory. I wasn't pushing for his sacking when it came, but most were, results were poor and performances too. It wasn't a surprise when it happened. Beale looked like the ready made replacement. He knew the club, had been part of Gerrard's success, was rumoured to be the brains behind it all and was keen to rejoin us. Again, at first he seemed an inspired appointment. The side started playing attractive football, January signings, Cantwell and Raskin, looked like big improvements to the squad and we went into the close season with genuine hope. For me it was apparent something was very wrong quite early on in the new season, I remember leaving the Olympiacos pre-season game very concerned about our set-up, style and new signings. His sacking, when it came, was a relief, for whatever reason the early promise had disappeared and change was needed. Clement was an unknown to me. No previous connection to the club or indeed Scottish football but with a decent track record in management including titles in Belgium. Once again his initial impact was good, for a while it looked like we might even win the league, something that looked impossible when he joined. Ultimately we didn't, falling to almost inexplicable defeats at Ross County and Dundee. We lost the Cup Final too, harsh refereeing going against us. The summer saw an exit of some familiar names, most of who the support felt had run their course, replaced by players largely unknown to us. This season has been not unlike Gio's, struggling against sides we should beat with a lack of energy or drive around the side. We have had some great performances and good results in Europe and finally beat Celtic, quite comprehensively. But it's a results business and Clement leaving would not come as a shock to anyone now. Each of those managers was backed, to an extent. But I'd argue through this time the club has 'downsized'. The loss to Malmo under Gerrard and our failure to qualify for the Champion's League that season was possibly the catalyst for a lot of what has happened since. Off the field the executive offices have been a revolving door, with a number of senior and important positions becoming vacant. I don't know Patrick Stewart, I've no inside info on him, but as a fan his appointment doesn't look like a ridiculous one. He has football experience, he understands how a big football club is run and the little we've heard from him he's not said anything worrying. Whether he'll be any good at it only time will tell. The work overrun on the Copland Stand in the summer was a poor look and an expensive one too. Clearly a project that was badly handled. On the plus side this board finally, after many, many false promises, addressed the challenges facing our wheelchair supporters. There should be criticism but also some credit too. There have been other works carried out on the old stadium too, often work that is essential but not visible to the average supporter. Work that should have been done long before it was. No board is above criticism and this one certainly isn't. Mistakes have been made and more will be made, that's the nature of these things. But on balance are they doing a bad job? I mean it's a low bar but they're undoubtedly the best board we've had this century.

Thought this deserved its own thread.

Apparently this is from the fan board minutes before the Queen's Park defeat.

There's no domestic trophy we can win so nothing lose don't worry we'll get our second place in the league

Tottenham v Man Utd is a belter with the positions of both clubs. Could be 5-5

It's more about getting a coach/manager who can get the best out of his player's you watch some of them playing for us and it's plain to see that a lot of them need a good hard kick up the arse we also need a coach who's not slow in giving the youth player's a chance i don't mean the odd start or bringing them on for 15 minutes give them a run of games a dozen or so to see first hand how they cope

I was just trying to take the discussion to a new level. Seems I succeeded! (for the record, I don't want Lennon anywhere in Scotland.) Though at first I thought you meant John Lennon!

Lennon?

Then you have endorsed my argument: we won't get better than Clement in the near future. Unless Rousseau's favourite, Mr Knudsen, can be persuaded.

Soon be time to send for big Sam at least he’d sort out the Tiller girls that pose as our defenders 😆 SEND FOR SAM

This.

I was completely unaware that I'm the solitary Rangers fan who wants Clement sacked. Thanks for pointing that out.

Other than making Cammy happy sacking Clement now achieves vey little. Most of his backroom team will leave with him, so we're into caretaker territory for a few weeks or months. Who would that be, Alex Rae? Neil McCann? McCoist? Certainly I think we can kiss goodbye to going any further in Europe. I think the board have already made up their mind and Clement won't be in charge for next season. They'll take the next few weeks to sound out a successor, as that person may already be in a job events will either change quite rapidly or we'll limp on until the inevitable announcement in May. I think Clement is a dead man walking and he probably already knows it.

To be fair Cammy, 99% of your chat on here is angry auld man type posts, so you'll forgive me for missing you dropping your guard, albeit momentarily. 🙂

What a finish to that game. And the bounce would have been ongoing at the Emirates as well. Feb becomes a pivotal month as Liverpool go to Man City and then have Newcastle.

It was tongue in cheek TBH 😎

I've been thinking about this and given the stakes I would say the defeats at Dundee and Ross County last season cost us the league when we could have stopped Celtic getting out of sight financially on us. I think a decent manager would have ensured victory in both those fixtures.

And with FFP (or whatever they call it now) even if someone was daft enough, it can't really happen, unless you start doing all the creative accounting that the likes of Chelski do.

STOP SAYING IT!

You did I never said we should sack managers every season, only the Clement should be removed. I've said previously we were too quick to sack Gio. I refuse to discuss with trolls who don't want discussion. You're good at quoting parts of the post and not in context. You're also good at asking questions but not answering. So there is little / no reason to indulge in a discussion with you. If you are happy with Clement then fine, that's your opinion and you are more than entitled to it. Those who want Celemet sacked are just as entitled to their opinion. It would benefit the discussion if you could give reasons (other than not sacking managers every season) as to why keeping Clement is a better option than removing him. I believe I've given my reasons for wanting him removed, let's hear your counter argument.

You have hit a lot of nails on the head there. Weir isnt coming near the SPL. Agree about McCann, very honest likeable guy and a cracking player but not the answer. Some middle parts of your post have now made me sway towards around 70/30 against Clement, there is nothing in almost 12 months now (Since Dingwall and Dens defeats) that gives me confidence that he can get near a league title - in fact Im more in the camp that it will regress further. I havent read David Holmes book but it would be very interesting to read what he did to turn things around and what his vision was - it couldnt have been rocket science with even less money available in those days per se. Yet he was also up against 3 maybe 4 teams of much better quality (was thinking if Hearts would be included with Aberdeen, Dundee Utd and Celtic in the mid 80s). Perhaps those who witnessed the earlier to mid 80s would have far better insight on this. Im not saying Clement out yet but if we pulled the plug I wouldnt be shouting from the roof tops its the wrong decision. Only a Mass upturn in our away form for "minimum" the rest of the season would get me more on board again...(and I hate chopping and changing managers unless it duds like Beale and Pedro then those do the hiring have to be blamed)

Yeah wasn't aimed at you as such, I've seen loads of criticism for him past few weeks on social media and the likes. Not sure what people are expecting is all.

I think this is where we need to be realistic about Jefte. He was a 500k signing, 20 year old from Brazil who played half a season of first team football in Cyprus before he came here. I'd say he has exceeded expectations so far. He just hasn't been able to put it all together. But we need to get used to having guys like this in the team. Its where we are at. He is here for what he can be, not what he is now. When I see Jefte I'm thinking about pre-leg break Alan Hutton. A raw player who had pace and running power, but was naïve defensively and didn't have a cutting edge going forward. Not sure exactly at what age, when or where it kicked in with Hutton, but it seemed like almost overnight he found the final ball, killer instinct and physicality that made him from a backup right back into a £10 million EPL premiership player. He was unplayable for a good 6 months before he left. I'm hoping that's what we see with Jefte. If we don't and he doesn't improve then at worst we have had 4 years of a low wage squad player who cost 500k.

Can you put the Queens Park team up? No player in blue deserves man of the match after that shambolic performance.

Ferry

I think the problem is that we can't currently afford success.