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I am left bemused and perplexed by the entire handball shenanigans. What on earth is a subjective handball? I thought VAR was supposed to bring more clarity and less subjectivity to the game. By my understanding of the rules, Johnstone's hand was not in a natural position and he moved his hand towards the ball and played it. These are two of the considerations that would bring about a penalty and a second yellow and red card. I saw the incident on TV last night again and watched Johnstone. His face tells a picture. He knew he had messed up and was waiting to be sent off. So, the ref missed it but VAR saw it. No problem we said, it is a clear handball but in 30 seconds Collum says no handball. I don't believe Collum is a cheat but he is a coward and incompetent. He did not use the opportunity to properly review the incident from various angles nor ask the ref to come to the monitor. The SFA have made matters worse by calling it a subjective handball when everyone knows that is nonsense. I would have preferred if someone with football knowledge and knowledge of the rules of the game had attended the meeting with the SFA. I have the feeling that they would run rings round Bisgrove and he isn't savvy enough to see through them. We are now in a place where the SFA have doubled down, the REFS are calling for a meeting and the 2 real culprits Clancy and Walsh have got away with it. Clancy's 2 minutes extra time at the end of the first have when there was a lengthy injury stoppage, substitution and a (albeit short) VAR call is a joke. Walsh's entire performance was strewn with errors entirely to our detriment and in their favour. He missed an opportunity to give Johnstone a second yellow when he had already yellow carded our player in an identical situation and another (can't remember his name) should also have been shown a second yellow. It was one of the worst performance I've ever seen and he does it all the time. These 2 are the real culprits and work to Celtic's advantage every time they are required. It is disappointing that the rest of Scottish football have yet again lost their tongues.

If I'm honest I find this thread utterly depressing. Rangers being linked with donkeys like Van Veen or Mckenna paints a picture of just how far off we are from the days when I loved to hear the UCL theme being played at Ibrox. My only hope is that Rangers are working hard behind closed doors to bring in players who are worthy of the club. Just my opinion.

The red card for St Johnstone a few weeks back and a similar incident in our first ever VAR game v Livi at home (I think) is a great small scale example of how VAR has mitigated bad refereeing decisions for us. I believe against the plankton the refs have an unconscious bias and allow for a certain level of leniency instead of calling it how they see it. VAR is a net gain for us. But it must be used correctly, honestly and the process around its use must be auditable and transparent.

Celtic FC don't often need to put pressure on refs because their placemen on TV and radio, in the written media, any platform where football is discussed, do it for them. The proportion of Celtic minded people in the media is disgraceful conscious bias. A show like "Off the ball" should be good family fun but it is used as a big stick to wallop Rangers and us, the fans.

He's not a Rangers fan. He just thinks he is.

The Parma team we faced in the 1999 UCL was as star studded as I can remember coming to Ibrox. Buffon, Cannavaro, Thuram, Ortega to name a few. We won 2 - 0 to progress

Similar, attended home(2-2) and away(1-1). If Kris Boyd had buried that chance in Spain, we would have deservedly progressed. Riquelme was a player, particularly in the first leg. In my time, Beckenbauer graced the Ibrox turf on three occasions, Gerd Muller too and, Paul Breitner. Johan Cruyff was special but my favourite was Valencia's Mario Kempes. The Argentine was the last opposition player I remember being deservedly rewarded with an Ibrox round of applause after scoring a wonder goal? We had drawn 1-1 away in Spain and the half time score at Ibrox was the same. Kempes scored two second half goals to secure a 1-3 victory.

Not a wrong word in that except I thought the spalpeen actually flicked the ball over the line with his hand. Penalty morning, noon and night.

Never mind watching garlic eaters. Stadium of Light is the place to be.

Mario Kempes for Valencia - 1979/80. Phenomenal player.

Players that I've left Ibrox thinking I never realised how good they actually were. Gaizka Mendietta Lilian Thuram Diego Forlan We knew how good Alessandro Del Piero was, but he still roasted us.

Scottish referees' union 'condemns' questioning of officials' integrity following derby controversy The Scottish referees' union "strongly condemn any commentary impugning" the integrity of officials. The Scottish Senior Football Referees' Association adds that "speculation surrounding the future appointment of referees" is "deeply unhelpful". The statement follows a meeting between the Scottish FA and Rangers, who had asked for the audio from an Old Firm derby VAR ruling, while the governing body rejected a suggestion that Willie Collum be kept from officiating on future games involving the Ibrox club. Collum was the video assistant referee at Celtic Park on 30 December. Rangers said the "overriding consensus" in their meeting with head of referee operations Crawford Allan was the decision of no handball against Celtic's Alistair Johnston was wrong. The SFA replied that they were "disappointed" with Rangers' comments and urged the club to show "greater responsibility". The governing body went on to say they "immediately rejected" requests relating to Collum detailed in a social media post from what they call a "recent official media partner" of Rangers. SFA 'disappointed' with Rangers in VAR row During the derby, which Celtic won 2-1, Rangers' Abdallah Sima was assessed to be in an offside position in the build-up to the penalty appeal, but Rangers insist this was not discussed by referee Nick Walsh and Collum. The SFA described the incident as a subjective handball and not a clear and obvious error that required review, pointing out that if there had been a review the offside would have been identified. The SSFRA welcomed "the clarification provided by the Scottish FA in relation to the recent Celtic v. Rangers match and, in particular, the confirmation that the supplementary offside pictures were provided by the Scottish FA to assist the media broadcasters and not at the instigation of the VAR or as part of the VAR decision making process at the time of the incident". And they added: "We wish to reiterate our full support for the VAR and on-field officials and strongly condemn any commentary impugning their integrity. "We also note speculation surrounding the future appointment of referees. Such requests from any clubs are deeply unhelpful and we endorse the Scottish FA in categorically rejecting any suggestion that clubs will influence match official appointments." https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67901742

Big cop out. Very few people’s work is free from scrutiny. Get it right and nobody will moan at you. Admit when you’re wrong and the moaning doesn’t disappear but it’s considerably reduced.

The referees have spoken... https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67901742 "The Scottish referees' union "strongly condemn any commentary impugning" the integrity of officials. The Scottish Senior Football Referees' Association adds that "speculation surrounding the future appointment of referees" is "deeply unhelpful". The statement follows a meeting between the Scottish FA and Rangers, who had asked for the audio from an Old Firm derby VAR ruling, while the governing body rejected a suggestion that Willie Collum be kept from officiating on future games involving the Ibrox club. Collum was the video assistant referee at Celtic Park on 30 December. Rangers said the "overriding consensus" in their meeting with head of referee operations Crawford Allan was the decision of no handball against Celtic's Alistair Johnston was wrong. The SFA replied that they were "disappointed" with Rangers' comments and urged the club to show "greater responsibility". The governing body went on to say they "immediately rejected" requests relating to Collum detailed in a social media post from what they call a "recent official media partner" of Rangers.".

Don’t see why not, they had them during the World Rugby Cup, new tactics for managers I sense if these are deployed.

Yes, Beckham came on as a sub. I remember there were half-hearted boos when he was on the ball. I thought that was a bit silly.

No change there then.

Referees will not be happy with Rangers for complaining I see lots of decisions going against us until the end of the season

Defended like his Rangers team

For Villarreal? Was at both home and away games and we were unlucky not to progress.

I think everyone but the main man knew it was a penalty but from some snippets I’ve been reading some referees are not keen on officiating at our games after the club had the temerity to ask questions.

Nonsense man. You are wrong, I am right. Where's the subjectivity in that? 😉

Since the issue of deliberate or accidental is irrelevant, there should be nothing subjective about it. If there is then VAR is a complete waste of time. There are two fairly straightforward decisions - did the ball contact the player's arm and was his arm in an unnatural position (whatever that is) at the moment of contact? In this particular case there was definitely contact and the are was well away from the player's body, so it's a mystery why subjectivity would come into it. In the beginning, it was thought by many that VAR would relieve officials of pressure by making it clear to fans why certain decisions were arrived at. In reality what it has done is provide fans with enough information to confirm how inadequate our officials are and have been all along. Now we have an incident that takes things further and sheds light on something much darker than incompetence, something that I've long suspected permeates not only football but virtually every institution in Scottish life. Willing corruption.

That's just silly talk.

Did anyone here see Riquelme? I wish I had.

Cause he is a step down in quality from Ridvan. He is very much SPFL quality. However, he is tall enough to ride a roller coaster, and he has only missed 14 games over the past two seasons to injury. In contrast to Ridvan's 38.

Internazionale v Hellas Verona on TNT1 just now, if anyone's interested in watching Doig in action.

Deliberate or not. Can you say with 100% accuracy that x, y, or z handled the ball accidentally or deliberately. That's an example of a subjective hand ball. For what it's worth, I think Johnstone handled it accidentally. A penalty still should have been awarded (and then rescinded as Sima was offside). You and I are disagreeing on this incident, suggesting that there's a level of subjectivity to it. VAR won't remove subjectivity from the game; there are too many instances where it's up to the subjectivity of the referee. (I don't disagree with your thoughts on the incompetence of our set-up.)

The Ridvan is away somewhere rumours gathering momentum. He has the makings of a decent player but is injured far too much for me so punt him pls.

I remember a welsh man by the name of Cliff Jones what a winger he was played for Spurs

How true is that. The two outstanding are di Stefano and Puskas. Then come the others and plenty of them. Gento, Mazzola, Schiaffino for the relics among us. There were two players, not big names but caused Rangers no end of trouble, Grillo of AC in 1957 and Johnny Crossan, Irish Republican, of Sparta Rotterdam 1960ish.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67890501 new rumours Dennis please no we need someone who is established in the SPL, only ones for me are Shankland up front or Van

Ronaldinho played against us for PSG IIRC?. Hadnt reached greatness yet, was quite young.

This is not the place to discuss politics.

Can't argue with any of this. The UBs add so much to the atmosphere and are 2nd to none when it comes to TIFO

I'm not sure that the Arsenal thing will have much of an impact. Calling for stiffer sentences for carrying a knife would be better. I think that the "Everyone Anyone" campaign does have merit though. A gay friend of mine suffered homophobic abuse abuse, albeit mild, at Ibrox and my daughter learned some sectarian terms a few weeks ago, which I'd have preferred her not to hear. Attitudes on things like this are changing and continued campaigns can help. In addition, it's helpful from a UEFA/KIO situation that they can point to it and show that they are trying.

Background noise is surely better than silence? Your argument falls down when you complain about them singing about players in the team. You obviously have no objectivity, which I guess is due to your interactions with them.. I can understand them being criticised for some of their repertoire but don't see what's wrong in creating songs about individual players. They are trying to support the current team. Are they meant to limit their songs to past players and BSOI? There's loads to complain about the UBs on, but the songs about the current players is bottom of the list. Tell me you didn't join in with the Lundstram song at the Leipzig game?

No to McKenna thank you.

Hopefully it's a step towards rail seating being put in, I'd love to see the whole of the Copland lower standing personally. By the sounds of it the club are doing a lot to mitigate/compensate the fans having to move - personally I think it's for the better of the team. Wee update on the cantilevers and wheelchair access too. What do you think?

Surely the denial of a penalty against Celtic and the subsequent cloak and dagger cover up suggests there is something VERY wrong with VAR. It's not just a case of missing things when the process becomes steeped in denials and contradictory explanations. The problem (as it was always bound to be) is that VAR has become just another tool to be employed by corrupt officials in Scottish football.