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Yip 100%. I've never felt so detached from the club since the toxic Murray days.

Giovanni van Bronckhorst believes it's too much to ask for his Rangers side to compete with certain teams in the #UCL A bit of effort, passion ,and enthusiasm is surely not too much to ask for though.

"fine lines"? I remain on the ile d'Oleron and tuned into BBC Radio Scotland for coverage of last night's opening Champions League fixture between ra Sellik and Real Madrid at ra Stade de Gadd. It was Big Dick hosting, another Dandy, Liam McLeod doing the live commentary; Tom English, Pat Bonner and, Michael Stewart doing the summaries. Chris McLaughlin did the pre-recorded background interviews(Chris along with his sister, Connie were in their usual comfy heated green leather seats in the north stand during the game). Big Dick and Liam really are the Dandy Dons Duo, a warm up act suitable to all salivating Yahoos. Big Dick eulogised the ground and atmosphere; Liam lionised the Green Brigade and the anthem, 'You'll never walk alone', "look at all those visiting Spanish Journalists recording the noise on their phones". The flashing disco lights, a nicked song about suicide and, choreography from the Village People; all done to the echo of the Green Brigade's Thompson gun. Big Dick began, "the strains of the Champions League music begin, not heard in this country for four years"? Oh, that would be Handel's Zadok the Priest, last played at Ibrox a fortnight past when PSV visited. Big Dick continued, "the last time Real Madrid were in Glasgow was forty-two years ago". Wrong again, they were at Ibrox last season losing 2-1, Sakala scoring the winner. Big Dick concluded the last time real lost a Euro final was 1983, to Aberdeen? If it does NOT involve Sellik or Aberdeen it did NOT happen. At half time and the teams tied at nil-nil, Big Dick congratulated ra Sellik ball boys on their uber quick re-circulation of the ball, "Real have been caught out twice by the rapid recirculation, I would like to have seen Celtic score". Big Dick qualifies that line by telling a whopper, "I say that because I want all Scottish clubs to do well in Europe". Tom English was ducking and diving in an attempt to avoid Big Dick's growing nose but, managed to squeal, "Ange will accuse me of being a sycophant however, his calmness, matter of fact delivery prematch has struck the right note in the team, Celtic are all over them". I hope the Producer bundled Big Dick and Tom into a room to allow both to compare their swelling glands? The last laugh is left to the man with the biggest ego, Michael Stewart. As Bill has stated above, ra Sellik PRO provides - suggests lines to enhance - ameliorate situations. The game has finished Sellik 0 Real Madrid 3 and former Sellik TV Presenter, Michael Stewart begins, "Fine lines, it was a game of fine lines". Michael suggests no one would argue if the game had finished 1-0 to ra Sellik or 4 or 5-0 to Madrid, "if you understand how a game is played and concludes on those fine lines". Michael took the listening public on a journey, "we have been here before, Celtic lost to Bobo Glimt in late February and, that was the wrong way to lose". It was Oswold Mosely-esque of Michael to provide the light to show the way of hooped futures, "those fine lines meant Celtic lost tonight but, they lost in the correct way". Michael halted, no doubt he self preened(does PQ provide a Fluffer) and concluded, "Celtic are moving in the right direction".

Is Jack in the team enough to be made Captian? The only players we have who play constantly are Tav, Goldson, Lundstrum and Kent. Jack is injury prone so I'd rule him out, maybe Lundstrum as a change. Old school thinking but we really should have 11 captions out there..

If performances of this standard continue, the prices keep going up and the cost of living crisis gets as bad as expected, things might get bad quickly. I've been thinking of packing in football for a couple of years and nothing much is changing my mind.

I really feel for Barisic. That was an incredible finish and so cruel to be ruled out like that. Kent was lazy to be so far offside there, no excuse for it.

Difficult, nay impossible, to find any positives after that. Quite simply the manager must account for these insipid displays and find improvement immediately. If not, he cannot stay. However, most of the players who are doing less than the bare minimum should be ashamed. It's tough to understand the manager's decisions though. If Morelos is in the squad on merit then why not give one of our best players at least 30mins? Similarly, why persevere with a deep passing tactic that is completely ineffective under any sort of opposition press? Onto the players and I'm astonished at their lack of commitment. Heroes from last year stroll around at walking pace; others refuse to track defensively and the schoolboy basics are beyond most. Very few take any sort of responsibility on the ball and most hide. Appalling. Ultimately, the standard won't stand. The manager can't allow it to and, if he fails to find improvement then board will have to step in. Where that leaves us with players with a disgraceful attitude, I don't know but the start to the season could not have been much worse.

I thought Leon King did okay.

Given this is the 3rd game this season where we've put in such a woeful performance, it suggests there's something seriously wrong. Clearly the system (in away games at least) isn't working but that doesn't account for the increasingly obvious lack of desire. It needs explained.

Scott Wright starting in the Johan Cruyff Arena tells you a lot about our recent transfer dealings.

Probably someone who has been trying to punt a large block of shares and met with zero success is trying to generate some interest in the hope someone will buy their holding. 👀

I tend to agree with Stewart. For me, celtic are indeed going in the right direction when they suffer a defeat at home by a comfortable margin.

Thomas Tuchel is available😉

We could actually compete in and lose the next 5 games. Competing and winning don't go hand in hand. Competing is the least we should expect - anything else is a bonus.

The league isn’t over, but its not far from being over. What have we honestly got to lose by giving guys like McCann and Lowry a chance at the price of dropping some of the serial under-performers. I guess it might need a tactical change which Gio might just not be willing to do? Or even be able to do? We’ve all had concerns about our one-note, one-pace performances against a lot of teams in the league, so if I hadn’t just seen that match tonight, I might have been convinced he’s a genius in Europe but can’t work out the Scottish game. Now I don’t really know what to think of him. From what I’ve seen on social media, there’s going to be two groups trying to shout the loudest about who’s to blame. The board, or Gio. I think they’re both to blame for how we’ve ended up here.

Likewise. Law of averages tells you there will be folk thinking this is just a knee-jerk reaction to a couple of bad results but the thing is, some of us can see the edge of the water fall.

Plus, getting said message to the club is a bit of a task now that the '' media '' is fan owned so any opinion that goes against the party line is shouted down. It's become a tad toxic from my point of view.

The new ticketing system including MyGers is a scam. There was nothing wrong with the old travel club or the ballots for away games. I stopped going to away games when we got back to SPFL as a token gesture and have refused to join MyGers. Over last few season I've started going back to away games to help the RSC when they are struggling to move tickets (Livi, Dundee, St Johnstone etc). I may get lambasted again but there is so much wrong with OUR club at the moment and this was getting "masked" due to run to Europa League Final. Now this scabs are being picked and are developing into open sores. Just don't expect engagement from the powers that be. Pay up and shut up.....

i would rather be beaten by Aberdeen after going hell for leather than win shuffling the ball about the back for 90 mins at this point

Ask yourself that. Competing is about fighting together, creating chances for each other , taking shots - it's not all about the final score. How many clubs have hundreds of millions to spend? If clubs without that level of spending cannot compete, the CL would be dead. Again, competing doesn't mean winning the CL.

We need to show determination, desire and fight first.

Yes. I still do. Dinamo Zagreb beat Chelsea yesterday. Don't take it so personally, Ian.

Depends what you mean by compete. Of course you can compete, may not win but they showed last night that you can compete.

Been saying it since we won the league.

No more for me. I'd sooner watch Therese Coffey model swimwear.

This is rubbish. The system is not working, they have acres of space all the time, our shape behind the ball needs to change or we will concede more.

Somebody in America has been running round saying they can buy rangers if you give them money. Darius seems to have blabbed that to his cousin in Glasgow and the club found out and are now suing said person.

You can watch the Ajax v Rangers CL youth game here (kicks off in a few mins) https://www.ajax.nl/artikelen/uefa-youth-league-duel-tussen-ajax-o18-en-rangers-fc-live-te-zien/

Whose to stop them? It seems endemic in Scotland at the moment that authorities can alter regulations or dismiss valid criticism at will.

Works in Scotland though. We need to be able to do both

Honestly mate , how some of our fans base look at top European teams is beyond me .

Good to see the hooped horrors getting stuffed

Sometimes it's the small things that reveal most. BBC Scotland's coverage of Celtic's drubbing at home from RM introduced us to the new stock phrase when their team is losing ... "Celtic is a club going in the right direction". This strange mantra was repeated verbatim by at least 4 commentators on TV and online in what is clearly a rehearsed and coordinated use of select language to assuage the faithful in times of trouble.

Yeah, pity for BB, great finish from him. But, it's like a fair few people on here have said, Gio needs to bench players like Kent and other serial under-performers and give some hungry youngsters their chance now. King doesn't look out of place, nor would McCann, Lowry as well when he's fit again.

Chelsea are expected to win the CL, we aren't - comparing apples with oranges. GVB will live of die by his domestic results not his CL results.

My BT connection was lagging half way through the 2nd half but to be honest our players were so slow I couldn't actually tell the difference.

I agree but another poor performance won't do GvB's reputation much good. We need to start playing some decent football.

It's brutal mate. Astounding how far we have fallen in such a short space of time.

Eh? Are you feeling ok?

Thank goodness I did.

A performance not one mm short of disgraceful. If I was to seek any +ves, I should say that, handily, we could leave the Manager and coaches in Holland. We could dump a few of the players over Dogger Bank. And, we could field the reserves against the sheepshaggers at the weekend!!

Limited options tonight down to injuries and poor squad management

He keeps picking the same players and same tactics expecting different results.

Like February, what really annoys me is why not change the system before you are getting hammered? It was clear as day it wasn’t working and and our luck was about to run out and the goals were going to start going in.

McLaughlin keeps his place Other than that team as above. Not much else he could do really. McLaughlin Tav Goldson Sands Barisic Lundstram Kamara Wright Tillman Kent Colak

Leipzig have also sacked their manager this morning - Tuchel's new job?

Yilmaz can play in place of Kent, which probably suits his game - he's very offensive. Who's the other?