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I`d start at the top with Gio (and Roy), continue with Goldson and end up with Kent. De facto, we have stagnated in Scottish football after about half a year of Warburton. It was him who installed the modern football 4-3-3 and we got away with that due to having superior players than the opposition. But whether in the Championship or indeed our first season(s) back in the Premiership, the opposition sussed us out, sussed our players out and simply adapted to their now common "hardcore" brickwall-and-hope-for-standards-or-counters style. Apart from the Scum, who simply had and have quality players that are on par with ours, no matter how much we might deny that. They had CL money and have been brutally effective with player sales. Yes, they get pummeled in Europe (and I for one do not look forward to games against Ajax and Liverpool, IF we don`t come up with extraordinary performances like we did against Leipzig, Dortmund or now PSV), but likewise have built a squad capable of beating nigh anything the Premiership puts in front of them. So why stagnate? Well, I might sound like a broken record, but we simply do not have the players to sustain that 4-3-3 / 4-2-3-1 style against those defensive line-ups that we essentially see every other week in Scotland. Not least when our main threat is not coming up with the goods and our wing-attackers are not weighing in with a reasonable amount of goals, and there is no-one really joining up in the attack from the midfielders. So while we indeed produce spectacular amount of chances, i.e. 15 to 30 shots of which 1/4 are on target, we don`t score enough goals. And if we are not up by 2 or 3, the opposition oftentimes goes gung-ho for the last 10 to 15 mins and we usually comply with presenting them with an equalizer. One only has to go through the league game charts of the last few seasons to note that our scorelines have the odd 2 or more clear goal wins, but many are close affairs, if not draws or worse. I know that people will see it differently, but 55 was not won because we pummeled anyone in obedience, but also (sic!) because a) our defence played a blinder and b) there were no supporters getting at the players' backs or "intimidating" our new signings. The season after 55, our defence went back to normal - and I for one was very suprised to see us giving Goldson a new long term deal. While at the other end, we continue our attempts at breaking down defences with inadequate means. We obviously did very well in Europe and thank the heavens for SG`s work in that department, which was continued by Gio. Yet, while our system and the players worked there, it was never really changed at home, where it was obvious that it was inadequate to get results in a way we are, IMHO, well capable of. Another point that will not sit right with many Bears is the simple truth that under Gerrard, and to an extent Gio too, we gave certain players far too much playing time when it was either not needed or not warranted. There is no doubt that Aribo, Kent and Kamara are fine footballers, yet e.g. we never really utilized Aribo to his real strengths (IMHO, central attacking midfield), but likewise hardly ever dropped him if his football was not the order of the day. The culmination of it all was playing him as the striker when Roofe and Sakala were on the bench in Seville. The same with Kamara. The lad is a fine footballer and a perfect DM and ball-winner. Yet, we started playing him further up the park and yesterday was a fine example that he can hold the ball up there and do little twists and turns, but he simply does not "hurt" the opposition. In 9 out of 10, make that 19 out of 20 cases up and around the penalty area, Kamara will pass the ball rather than shoot himself. Yet under SG we oftentimes played him and Davis/Lundstram/Jack, when only one of them was needed. Hence, much like that horrendous inter-passing of our defenders in deep midfield, we are probably kings of possession and passing, but the last time these stats won you a game was never. And then there is Kent. He`s been here since 2018 and his style hardly ever changed. At times, he looks like he`s destined for a return to Liverpool and the EPL, and then he looks like a different version of Gregg Wylde, a speed merchant with hardly any end product. Be that as it may, my biggest bone of contention with him remains the fact that as a attacker he doesn`t score enough goals. His stats as a left-winger are probably second to none, yet in days gone by we would not have expected a Neil McCann to chip in with 10-20 goals a season, which essentially is what is required of a 3-man attack line per player. Kent was SG`s darling and is probably the most used player next to Tavernier and McGregor over the SG years. No matter whether he actually came up with any goods. The "funny" thing is, that for ages the support saw something in him that seemingly never was in Wright, Sakala, you name it, who get slaughtered every other week, no matter whether they chalk up goals, assists or good play. Some sort of objectivity got lost here. Same with us playing 4-2-3-1 against no matter who, when it is clear that this does not work in Scotland. And it is gut-wrenching to see Gio and Roy sitting there watching on and you think: there`s one star-striker who should get it into Gio that this one-striker-stuff and underperforming "wing-attackers" don`t cut it. I usually keep watching through even our dire games and while I didn´t see it, we were humbled 2-6 in Advocaat`s reign when they scored with nigh any chance while we didn`t, despite having enough chances ourselves. We beat them 5-1 in the return game. But yesterday I simply had enough after 45 mins. Kent doing his dribblings on the right side of defence when a simple clearance (our defenders have seemingly forgotten that word combination too) no matter where would have eased the danger. Throw in, quick passes, 0-1. Next he was up at the other end, taking the ball from the halfway line and running till he was about 5 yards out and confronted by that one defender too many, chance missed - Part 463. Minutes later, Kamara on the left wing exchanging passes with Kent and Borna for fun, but no penetration, till we loose the ball. As I said, we stagnated and hardly ever adapted to the opposition at hand ... we simply changed the players for the respective positions and hoped for the best with better quality. Unless we stop this one-striker dross against the brickwall brigade, play decent wingers alongside 2 strikers, we will just toil on, every then and now "blinded" by a mauling against teams like the Stags last week. As soon as Davies and Helander are back, Goldson needs to get "a little breather" ...

Said yesterday the our board (and I've heard this from a very good source) have prioritised Europe over domestic success. As long as Gio or who ever is the manager continues to bring in £30-£40M from Europe, domestic negligence will be accepted. I don't see Gio doing a SG and leaving due to not being backed. Someone said yesterday that Celtic are our barometer. If that is the case, they have shown that you can't rule domestically as well as excelling in Europe. Their model is simple - win the league and get automatic qualification to CL. If that doesn't happen, sell 4 or 5 players at an profit. Also, if Celtic are our barometer, check the difference in transfer budgets - their spend dwarfs ours. There is so much wrong with our Club - ticketing, customer service, safe standing, catering, diasabled access to name a few issues and now we've been added to UEFA FFP watch-list, the purse strings are not going to be lossened. Our board are NOT what we need to take us forward but they aren't going anywhere soon so we're stuck with them. The league is not lost, but its now an uphill battle to get back into the race but with (financial) pressure on us to progress in Europe, all our energy and focus will be on that. After the sale of Aribo, Patterson and Bassey we don't have players sales to fall back on - Kamara would be the only player we could sell for a profit in the January transfer window. Bleak period ahead... unless this team clicks and goes unbeaten from now until end of season which I can't see happening.

Switch the managers around and he'd change alot of the players. Our squad is inadequate, not balanced, doesn't have enough energy, is only occasionally motivated and is primed for finishing 2nd in a 2 horse race. This manager hasn't got what it takes to turn this around.

It is beggars belief that after two transfer windows we finished the game with stevie gs team. We should have had a clear out after we won the league. That teams shelf life was up then. It concerns me that not only are the majority still here we're giving them new contracts. Who ever is making these decisions needs to be removed.

Iirc it will be another 2 seasons before that is in place. If we want to dine at the top table then we have to pay top table prices in saying that more could be done in helping to spread the cost given the times we find ourselves in. I'm content in the belief that this Board is serious in its intent to address this long term scandal. The irony is that it's not a fault of their own making, blame for this lays at David Murray's door. Murray probably uses a wheelchair every single day yet I have only ever seen 2 photos of him in one. One of which was while he was still in the hospital after his accident. No and I imagine we'll see no great improvements in that area until the concourses are refurbished and modernised. I've yet to attend Ibrox since the change in caterers so don't personally know if the new crowd are better than Elior, most reports seem to indicate that while not without teething troubles the food itself is better. It probably is unrealistic for anything more than a basic outline which I'm sure the Club will argue the provide in the annual company report and AGM. If that's in respect the the refereeing/SFA/SPFL etc then yes they should be a lot more vocal and public in their condemnation. No it's absolutely vital that we do, if history has taught us anything it's that. The current Board won't cause me any sleepless nights, they get it, they know what it's about and they've put in their own money. Better the devil you know.

Exactly. And don't get me started on our one dimensional corners...

The attitude from the players yesterday absolutely stank, but I just can't believe we've ended up here with this bunch of players, playing the (almost) same formation and making the same mistakes and displaying the same issues we've all seen for the last 3/4 seasons. Nobody got pass marks yesterday, on or off the pitch and we do need to be a bit realistic about the finances - Celtic are still ahead in that regard because of how long they've been unopposed to get the CL qualification along with their player trading model etc. I also think the size of our squad is probably the main reason we didn't buy any more players. We have various big earners who are either injured or aren't first XI picks. That was a terrible display from McLaughlin. But most of us thought he was the best option of our 3 keepers and probably still is. Why is McGregor still here? Dropping him was the first big (and easiest) decision Gio had last year and he bottled it. McCrorie or McLaughlin should have been in and we should have either signed a new #1 in the summer or promoted McCrorie and let Greegs and maybe McLaughlin leave. All of that has meant Gio has another tough decision to make and its of his own doing. Luck hasn't been with us with injuries, but you need a strong spine of a team and in the SPFL in particular, we seem unable to do the basic sort of defending you need to do. We've got away with so many near things over the last 3/4 years - set pieces, corners, long balls etc where you need a couple of centre halves who can just do the simple things well. Goldson's fitness record is incredible, he's been a great servant, but we need better. I was surprised when he re-signed as I'd have been happy for him to go. At some point we need to move on. Do we ever learn? Are any of the coaching staff not seeing the same things we are? When was the last time Kent had a few games in a row where he played to the best of his ability? Sakala? He's not a striker, he is at least unpredictable when he's playing wide and cutting-in, but he seems to be down the pecking order, so why is he still here? Helander & Roofe? Still here, on big wages and utterly unreliable over the course of a season. Morelos & Kent? In to the last 6 months of their contracts. Are either work keeping based on what we know we'll get (or not) from them over the course of a season? Jack looks done. McGregor, Davis & Arfield - Reasonable wages for players who aren't going to start every week. Influential in the right games, but are they worth it for the cost? Young players - at what point should we take the punt that some like Lowry and McCann are worth giving a real run in the first team rather than spending money on incoming transfers who may not be any better than them? Setup far too defensively in many league games. Very one-note pace and system in these games. At least we've added Lawrence who seems to want to shoot from outside the box. But ffs, watching us week in, week out, its like nothing's changed since Gerrard came in (not just some of the players) and we're just going to keep on doing the same thing week after week expecting a different result. Europe's been incredible, but surely its not asking much of the management and players to be able to setup differently for the different challenges we face?

I knew this day was comin. McLaughlin starts in goal. Most definitely. What happened on Saturday was not JUST his fault. It takes a team to get whipped like that. Was he perfect, or even good? No...but it takes a team.

We were placed on the UEFA FFP watchlist recently. No it isn't. No.

It might as well have been me but i was sitting in my living room in Airdrie but was still closer than any of our fucking defenders.

If, but and maybe content warning !! Maybe another season, who knows....... He was always going South when a decent offer came up post league win. Just maybe, with the right recruitment he would have committed for another full season.

To be fair, our players barely understood what was going on around them yesterday. So maybe all of them were MOTM...

McCrorie should be given a chance, did extremely well before when called upon.

To be fair to Warburton and Gerrard at least you could see what the system was and what they were attempting. Under Gio is just pass across the back 4, repeat, repeat, repeat then lose the ball.

No matter how badly we performed as a team there is always at least one player that gives a fuck and therefore should be voted for.

The league is our bread and butter - it's an old cliché but it's true. I can accept losing to the scum if we play well and put up a good fight - we did neither yesterday.

To be honest, apart from that inaugural CL run and the odd result here and there, we've been utter dog$hit in Europe for my entire lifetime. Maybe that's what it comes down to though, that its just not easy to have a squad capable of doing both which you could argue Celtic are proving, but in reverse to us.

I've never understood why people think that not voting is somehow a statement in itself. It's not, it's just a huffy display of petulance.

Yeap. Im gonna tell you right now...Gio lets that shit happen again that should be his ass...he knows better than that. CL be damned. Disgusting.

The League is already gone because of three main reasons. 1. 5 point lead plus GD 2. They have our number in OF league matches and we don't have the squad/mgmt. to turn that round in short term. 3. Speed, tempo, goalscorers all over the pitch, energy, motivation, belief, direction. They have it in spades (we don't) and provincial teams look to mitigate damage. Against us, they know they have a chance. Our runs of league wins rarely go beyond 4. They tend to do 7/8.

The league is over. This is not based on yesterday but the fact that our overall away record is piss poor. We've backed ourselves into a corner which means we simply cannot afford to drop points. Can anyone see this team going on a 15 20 match winning streak? Last season and our form this season suggest otherwise.

We have a load of games from now until November. Is it fair to say there is a risk with Barkley or indeed any signing at this point that by the time they get to speed the World Cup will be kicking off.

We have two No.2 goalkeepers.

And he has taken our incoming revenue to the next level and doesn't push for signings so he's the golden boy.

We have about 30 coaches on the sidelines and yet no-one made the players aware that Celtic were tactically using quick throws and free kicks. To be honest everyone should be have been aware after the first time but when it happened again and again, that was criminal.

Losing to much more expensively assembled teams isn't really being 'found out'. The domestic situation is the real concern, particularly our away form. We knew how Celtc would play yesterday but the team didn't look prepared at all. Why was that!?

Yes you can. If you have the right players who fit in to a coherent system. At this stage, I'm not sure what our system or playing identity is under Gio.

We need to get these signing on the park and up to speed asap.

What does it matter how good or bad they are in the CL? What difference will that make to what we witnessed today or our chances the next time we meet them? It's exactly this kind of point-scoring pissing contest that hides the truth.

.... and the manager on the touchline!

Agree. And I'll say it again, too many players have not been given a proper run of games - it's difficult to get up to speed with a few cameos and starting one week and then on the bench the next. I know he hasn't hit the ground running, but I have high hopes for him. he's shown glimpses with some great assists already. The same goes for Davies and Yilmaz...and the youngsters, if we want a player trading model like Ajax, we need to support the kids (that have great potential) and play them even if they make mistakes, that's the only way to learn. Nothing to lose now. Europe target achieved and we certainly need to shake things up in the league games.

It's very difficult to vote as no-one did their job effectively. Barisic can perhaps be given some credit for some reasonable attacking play but he was as culpable as anyone else defensively. Kent had one or two pieces of good play but his end product was non-existent. Sands coped well one minute then floundered the next. I don't think anyone else did anything of note in a positive sense - maybe Wright for a couple of decent bits of play but hey-ho. All in all, it's quite embarrassing to have to clutch at these straws so I can understand why some folk would rather not vote.

Feburary 2022 2 : Celtic 3 Rangers 0 17 : Dortmund 2 Rangers 4 20 : Dundee Utd 1 Rangers 1 24 : Rangers 2 Dortmund 2 27 : Rangers 2 Motherwell 2 Up and doon like a whore's knickers Lost a league (more or less) Famous result in Europe Can't see lightning striking twice in Europe Better win ALL domestic games

Changing executive directors should always be a consideration. You see what can happen (eg. SPFL/Doncaster) if you don't. Gets too comfortable, doesn't deliver but gets high pay increases. Without knowing the fine detail around Robertson and what he delivers..... Like many, I feel we might benefit more with better/stronger leadership from a CEO type figure rather than MD. Downside, it may cost an extra 0.5M pa.

Arsenal goal chopped by VAR - probably right decision

Going back to throw-ins the last time I can remember was when Candeias took one to Windass(I think) and a goal was scored.Now we have ONLY the full backs taking them and taking an eternity to do so. When I took primary school football,many moons ago,I taught the kids how to keep the game flowing with quick throw-ins/free kicks. That cannot be a task beyond Gio and his coaches.

Worst player on the park for me. Fell asleep while they had quick set pieces for 1 & 3 then slowed down our attacks when he was on the ball. Funny how people see things differently 🤪

I love Potter...

Yes, threads do stray. I thought I'd try and shift it back on topic, but that's a lost cause now, I suspect. I thought you were the first to bring up off-field issues? Apologies if not. Valid points, but nothing to do with the thread. It's a bit of a pet peeve of mine, to be honest: bringing off-field issues into the criticism of on-field performances.

Your points have no relevance to the topic of the thread. It comes across like you're upset at a defeat and are dredging up any grievance to stick the knife in - same with the RSA tweet, for me. Your points are valid, but maybe open another thread?

OK, but apart from plumbing and sanitation, what has this board ever done for us?

What does it matter whether or not I trust the Board? Do you think I have the power to remove them or dictate policy? What I think is they are the directors and have the authority and fiduciary duty to decide how the club is run. I think they have done very well so far and have made enormous strides forward. They are clearly competent people but they operate in a world where external forces can change the game overnight and where the dreaded human factor makes accurate planning almost impossible. The biggest problem the Board faces is the unrealistic expectation of the support. It's one thing to want something but quite another to think you've achieved your goals when you're still actually scratching the surface. The directors are not miracle workers but they've shown enough to convince me they are likely to create a far more secure and successful club in 3 to 5 years from now (my estimate only). If fans can't accept that timeframe then they need to realise they're could jeopardise the entire project.

Yip, but asking football fans to think reasonably is a lost cause....!

Agreed, but maybe its romantic nostalgia but under SG we seemed to get better every season, we had players who had sell-on values etc. On the European stage, there is little to criticise GVB on - the EL final was disappointing but on ballance we probably deserved to lose on the night, but it was a great effort and different from the loss to Zenit, which made it harder to accept. Off the field, we have neglected so many issues (catering, ticketing, disabled access, customer service), it just seems things are stalling a little.

Barkley, surely not. Ages to get up to speed Not available for CL High wages We have seen this movie before

Real putting them in their place doesn't help us as no-one domestically can put them in their place, certainly not us going by yesterday's capitulation

Just noted that Ross Barkley is still a freebie and Southampton are interested, yet "face competition from us". Methinks the CL squad-list window is closed now, so we won`t be able to offer him that sort of footie for the time being, only game time. That said, I have no clue whether he is "any good" (well, he wouldn`t have been at Chelsea if he wasn`t) nor whether we were actually in for him.

Title race? Is there one? They are already 5 points ahead with a healthy GD. We have to to go to Pittodrie and Tynecastle in 2 of our next 3 league games. I would be gobsmacked if we get 6 pts from those 2 games, especially given the fact they are sandwiched between a glut of demanding CL fixtures. The league is over IMO. It was put out of its misery yesterday but was fatally wounded at Easter Road. They are simply not going to drop points against anyone else. We had to go into this game on level terms but we entered the game knowing that they were ahead already. To be honest, the fixtures have not been kind. If we were to pick our 5 toughest away fixtures in this league I would gather that the majority of fans would say Parkhead, Pittodrie, Easter Rd. Tynecastle and Livvies plastic monstrosity. Its curious how they have all popped up in 5 of our 9 opening fixtures. Does Peter Liewell have shares in the technology that decides the fixtures?

One would think a man of that advanced age would have learned not to talk shit to another grown man...player or not. Can you imagine what drivel was drippin from that old goat's mouth? About his kids maybe? His wife? His mother? I wish athletes would punch fans more...maybe people would learn to zip their yap. Not an ex-Celtic player thing...just a man respect thing.

Until we start to properly mark Abada & Jota at CP we will continue to struggle there. Who was marking Abada at both of his goals?